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Is Islam violent and intolerant? |
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Rezz 
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Joined: 13 July 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 62 |
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 Topic: Is Islam violent and intolerant?Posted: 06 September 2007 at 6:28am |
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I don't wish to insult anyone, I'm here to try to learn. This Website describes Islam as "a religion of peace, mercy, and forgiveness". However, I have just finished reading a book, which appears to demonstrate that Islam is fundamentally an intolerant and violent ideology. The book relies on and quotes only accepted Islamic texts such as the Qu'ran, Hadith and Sunna. It also argues (convincingly in my opinion) that Muhammad was a warlord and bandit who preached violence, ordered the assassinations of his enemies, and used his "divine revelations" for his personal self-aggrandizement. I have checked the Islamic sources quoted in the book in own Qu'ran and on the Internet and found them to be accurate. Further more, I recently had a discussion with a highly religious Muslim on flight from Moscow to the Middle East and was concerned with some of his views concerning the killing of apostates, cartoonists, Israelis, Salman Rushdie, infidels etc. I've also looked at some of the posts on these discussion forums and concluded that many seem to point more towards a belief in violence, cruelty and hate, than in "peace, mercy, and forgiveness". I look at the violent actions of so many Muslims in the world today and wonder whether their actions are the result of their religion. Are there any books I can read that can convince me that Islam really is "a religion of peace, mercy, and forgiveness"? Edited by Rezz |
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Angela
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Joined: 11 July 2005 Status: Offline Points: 2555 |
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Posted: 06 September 2007 at 7:37am |
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Rezz,
Like Christianity and Judaism, there will always be those that take things out of context, focus on a narrow view and use their beliefs to discriminate and twist it to their own ends. My first suggestion is to read the Quran. As a Christian, I found that most questions can be answered right in the pages. The second thing I would suggest is when you come to the battle sections...compare the dates of revelation with what was happening to the Muslims at the time. Many revelations were given during the severe and brutal persecutions of the Muslims by the pagans of Mecca. They also suffered a hard betrayal by a Jewish tribe in Medina. Most of the "justifications" I have seen for all this nonsense come from revelations handed down to the followers during these times. Now, Muslims may argue with me. But, I personally feel that is significant because they were words for the people during those times. I also believe that they are so often misused and taken out of their context to assist men with agendas. I stop short of using the media terms of radicals or fundamentalists because these men are pure evil and could have been just as easily spawned by Christianity, Hinduism or any other faith. Why? Because they are looking for justification anywhere they can squeeze it from. Secondly, I would also read the Hadiths. There are many times where the Prophet says.....do not do this.....do not do that. And yet, those are ignored by these groups because it busts their justifications. I'm not going to say Islam is pacifist. It is not. But, neither is Christianity or Judaism. The only reason this is even an issue in 2007 is because of a handful of nutcases and thugs who want to impose their twisted interpretation of things onto the world. This was us (Christians) circa 1100AD. This was the Romans, Greeks and Egyptians before us. This is Mao Tse Tung (spelling), Lenin and Hitler. Hitler used the Bible to justify his Nazi ideals. Lenin twisted Marx. Islam is not a pacifist religion, not by a long shot, but its not the warmongering hate filled religion that we see on TV either. It if truly was, the world would be in a lot of trouble. 1 in 4 people on this planet are Muslim. If Islam really was the threat the media and our governments want us to believe. We'd already be in trouble. Indonesia and Malaysia are Islamic states, you don't see them invading or even having massive armies. Peace, mercy and forgiveness. These are divine traits often ignored by supposedly religious people. Since when did God tell Christians it was okay to spew forth hate speech against others. Just go to an anti-gay rally sometime. Or watch the "Stop the Madrassa" people in New York that are protesting the Arabic School. (Nevermind NY has several of these schools in other languages like Japanese, Chinese and German) Its about separating the people from the message. Islam is about submitting yourself to God. If you are truly doing that, you are not harming another soul. The last thing I would suggest is that you read articles like this... http://www.al-islami.com/islam/religion_of_peace.php?p=2 It has references to what is and is not prohibited in war. |
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Rezz
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Joined: 13 July 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 62 |
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Posted: 07 September 2007 at 12:38am |
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Thanks for your reply Angela. You suggest I read the Qu�ran. I have (in English) and found it to contain some very worrying passages. If you�re saying that Muhammad�s revelations should be taken in the historical context of the time they were revealed then this would leave much of the Qu�ran open to wide interpretation (much like the Bible); and I believe that this would be a positive thing. However, I would be surprised if many Muslims would agree with you about �context�. It seems that true Muslims actually believe in the Qu�ran as the literal word of God. It is their answer to every question; it is their ultimate source of guidance and such what the Qu�ran commands. So I�d be very interested to hear from any Muslims who support with your opinion. Angela, you haven�t addressed my concerns about the life of Muhammad. Even if his many intolerant, violent and even cruel deeds might seem more reasonable if considered in the historical context in which they happened, it still concerns me that many Muslims believe that they should live by Muhammad �s example. Violent Jihadists see themselves as following the example of Muhammad in word and deed. You also suggest I read the Hadiths. I have read some that are so outrageous that I believe some Muslims doubt their reliability. I�m interested Angela, you're a Christian: do you believe the Qu�ran to be, even in part, the word or will of your God? Finally, I�d be interested to hear from any knowledgeable Muslims on the original question. |
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islamispeace
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Posted: 07 September 2007 at 10:00am |
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Rezz,
You say there are certain verses of the Quran and certain hadiths which "worry" you. Well, lets bring them out. Please make a list, and I as well as the other Muslims on this forum will be more than happy to help you understand. |
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Say: "Truly, my prayer and my service of sacrifice, my life and my death, are (all) for Allah, the Cherisher of the Worlds. (Surat al-Anaam: 162)
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Angela
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Posted: 07 September 2007 at 7:08pm |
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Rezz,
Since the basis of the Quranic teachings are belief in God, Prophets like Abraham and Moses and family. Yes, I do believe there is divine inspiration, however, as a Christian I don't believe in the infalliblity or perfection in the Quran as would a Muslim. If I did, then I would be Muslim. This is why I point to things like context and environment where a Muslim might not. Did you read that article I sent you? The ayahs that usually worry us the most are often taken out of context of the whole Surah. We are talking about a faith in its infancy that is being persecuted and a region filled with War for millenniums before Muhammed and long after. What actions do you find particularly disturbing? Stoning was a common punishment among, Jews, Christians and other peoples of that time period. War was not only necessary, but unavoidable. Slavery was culturally accepted throughout the entire world including among European Christians for centuries to come. Under Muhammed, women were given inheritance rights, the right of divorce and rights of ownership over her property. This was not extended to British women until the 19th Century. And all they were required to do, was be faithful to their husbands and cover up. Not a bad trade off if you ask me. I certainly would have rather been a woman in Muhammed's time in Saudi Arabia than a woman in Muhammed's time in London. So, what exact Ayahs and actions most concern you? |
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BMZ
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Posted: 08 September 2007 at 12:42am |
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Yes, that is a good idea. BMZ |
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BMZ
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Posted: 08 September 2007 at 12:45am |
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BMZ |
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Alwardah
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Posted: 08 September 2007 at 12:57am |
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Hi Angela Your answers always amaze me. I still find it difficult to believe that you are not a Muslim. May Allah guide you soon Ameen! Take Care |
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�Verily your Lord is quick in punishment; yet He is indeed Oft-Forgiving Most Merciful (Surah Al-An�am 6:165)
"Indeed, we belong to Allah and to Him is our return" (Surah Baqarah 2: 155) |
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islamispeace wrote:
Very well said, Angela. Could not have written better. Thanks