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In defence of religious freedom
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Ron Webb View Drop Down
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    Posted: 20 December 2015 at 11:24am
Originally posted by Tim the plumber Tim the plumber wrote:

Who was Justice Murphy and what was he talking about?

I don't know where abuayisha came across the quote, but you can read it in context from the link I provided: https://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/315/568
Addeenul �Aql � Religion is intellect.
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Tim the plumber View Drop Down
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Originally posted by abuayisha abuayisha wrote:

I agree with Justice Frank Murphy who opinioned;

�It has been well observed,� wrote Justice Frank Murphy, �that such utterances are no essential part of any exposition of ideas and are of such slight social value as a step to truth that any benefit that may be derived from them is clearly outweighed by the social interest in order and morality.�


Who was Justice Murphy and what was he talking about?
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Ron Webb View Drop Down
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Points: 2467 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 December 2015 at 8:06am
Let's be clear what Justice Murphy was referring to by "such utterances":

"There are certain well defined and narrowly limited classes of speech, the prevention and punishment of which have never been thought to raise any Constitutional problem. These include the lewd and obscene, the profane, the libelous, and the insulting or "fighting" words -- those which, by their very utterance, inflict injury or tend to incite an immediate breach of the peace. It has been well observed that such utterances are no essential part of any exposition of ideas, and are of such slight social value as a step to truth that any benefit that may be derived from them is clearly outweighed by the social interest in order and morality.

"Resort to epithets or personal abuse is not in any proper sense communication of information or opinion safeguarded by the Constitution, and its punishment as a criminal act would raise no question under that instrument."
Chaplinsky v. New Hampshire (No. 255) (1942)

The specific "epithets or personal abuse" to which Murphy referred were the phrases "damned Fascist" and "damned racketeer", which by the standards of 1942 were quite a bit more vulgar and abusive than they might appear today.
Addeenul �Aql � Religion is intellect.
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abuayisha View Drop Down
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Points: 5105 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abuayisha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 December 2015 at 7:07am
I agree with Justice Frank Murphy who opinioned;

�It has been well observed,� wrote Justice Frank Murphy, �that such utterances are no essential part of any exposition of ideas and are of such slight social value as a step to truth that any benefit that may be derived from them is clearly outweighed by the social interest in order and morality.�
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Tim the plumber View Drop Down
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Points: 944 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tim the plumber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 December 2015 at 9:43am
Originally posted by abuayisha abuayisha wrote:

very interesting case, and hopefully it will send a strong message against overheated rhetoric.


If he gets a fine then many hundreds of Islamic preachers should get jailed.

Do you wish to see free speach limited like that?

I don't. I want there to be a bias on the side of allowing free speach and only when violence is expressly called for would there be a problem.
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abuayisha View Drop Down
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Points: 5105 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote abuayisha Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 December 2015 at 7:18am
very interesting case, and hopefully it will send a strong message against overheated rhetoric.
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Tim the plumber View Drop Down
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Points: 944 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tim the plumber Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 December 2015 at 9:55am
The British National Secular Society, an organisation dedicated to the removal of religious privilage and influence on the state, is campaining to uphold the rights of a preacher from Northern Ireland who has been charged with offensive preaching after he uploaded a video of a sermon;

http://www.secularism.org.uk/news/2015/12/verdict-delayed-in-ridiculous-prosecution-of-preacher-in-satanic-islam-case

OK, he said stuff that was offensive. And?

It is strange that it is the secular types who are at the forefront of defending his freedom to shout his wrong views.
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