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Ayesha12345678
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Topic: contradictions in the "holy" quran? Posted: 21 May 2022 at 1:23pm |
I am really lazy to write those stuff again. This is my page. i will send you the link of posts and answer those questions that i have written there (those posts answer your statements very clearly) :
Some christians don't dare to read those posts when i send them, because they are afraid i might be right. And yet, they claim that they are seeking knowledge. Read those posts, (sadly i dont have them saved in word, otherwise i would just send them as one) and you can comment there your answers or even here. Those posts are made with deep research and logic. Simple logic and sense. If you think religion can't be logical and make sense, you haven't known islam. Islam is logical and makes sense. Trinity doesn't make sense ( at least read first two posts about logical arguments about trinity). some christians say it is wisdom of God. No. trinity is nature of God. Nature of God is explicit in every religions and should be clear. wisdom of God is how God handles affairs in universe. Wisdom of God can be mysterious. Nature of God, can't.
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Ayesha12345678
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Posted: 21 May 2022 at 12:36pm |
3. The first Muslim was Muhammad? Abraham? Jacob? Moses? - First ever muslim was Adam (As).
- verses you said, there first to believe means ,,before preaching my message to you and tell you to submit to Allah, i should give example and should be first one among you to submit Allah". Even by reading it, you get same idea. unless you really want to say something against, you should have no problem understanding those verses like this.
4. Does Allah forgive or not forgive those who worship false gods?5. Are Allah's decrees changed or not? 6.Was Pharaoh killed or not killed by drowning? - even by the context of verses, you clearly can read that Pharaoh was drowned and killed. but his soulless body was kept so that it would be sign for generations to come. easy peasy.
7. Is wine consumption good or bad?- wine which is on earth is intoxicant, thus consumption is bad. Which will be in heaven, will be so pure that it wont have any intoxicant.
- Truly the Righteous will be in Bliss: On Thrones (of Dignity) will they command a sight (of all things): Thou wilt recognize in their faces the beaming brightness of Bliss. Their thirst will be slaked with Pure Wine sealed," (83:22-25).
- 52:23 - They will give to one another cups of wine, bearing no resemeblness to the wine of this world, free from intoxication and that which arises from it, such as false speech.
— Abridged Explanation of the Quran Al-Mutaffifin 83:25 - They will be given a drink of sealed, pure wine, - Dr. Mustafa Khattab, the Clear Quran Al-Waqi'ah 56:19 - that will cause them neither headache nor intoxication. — Dr. Mustafa Khattab, the Clear Quran 56:19- It is not like the wine of the world; it’s drinkers will not get headaches nor suffer intoxication. — Abridged Explanation of the Quran
I can easily say that you read Quran with biased mind and ignored many verses. Didn't even try to look for explanation of verses. I even doubt that you read Quran fully. Bible has serious contradictions. See this paper, called ,,101 contradictions of Bible" : https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-b5NFCAMMiRFPmxCdlk7Iguqm2EXJkm6/view?usp=sharing. Those contradiction are so severe that you can't explain in any way even by reading commentaries and explanation. May Allah guide you to straight path. Ameen
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Ayesha12345678
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Posted: 21 May 2022 at 12:34pm |
1. What was man created from, blood, clay, dust, or nothing?2. is there or is there not compulsion in religion according to the Qur'an? - "Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things," (2:256).
- "And an announcement from Allah and His Messenger, to the people (assembled) on the day of the Great Pilgrimage,- that Allah and His Messenger dissolve (treaty) obligations with the Pagans. If then, ye repent, it were best for you; but if ye turn away, know ye that ye cannot frustrate Allah. And proclaim a grievous penalty to those who reject Faith," (9:3).
- This means that there is no compulsion in religion, because you have free will to choose between right and wrong but that doesn't mean that you won't be punished for doing wrong. choosing wrong is your decision and noone can force you and noone has right to force to choose right choice or even make you do wrong thing. for example, in country we have freedom of choice, freedom of speech, freedom of expressing one' s self, right of life, right of practicing one's religion, but that doesn't mean that if you express yourself by killing someone unjustly, or your religion tells you to kill innocent people for example for sacrifice (like ancient times), isn't it a crime? shouldn't we punish transgressors of law? yeah it is true, noone can force you to kill someone, even for religious purposes, because you have freedom of choice, free will to choose between right and wrong, but does that mean that you shouldn't be punished for killing someone unjustly? then where is justice? it was your choice to transgress the law and consequences were you being punished. Allah is the most Just. that is why punishment exists for transgressors in religion, but you will be good or bad is totally upto you. angels have no free will, they are have no other choice but to be good. you have that choice, but you are also responsible for your actions. again, simple logic.
- now about next two verses (3-4 in your list). lets see what whole Quran says about it and verses before it. because there are other verses regulating these verses. they cant be understood seperately.
- 9:4 - As for the polytheists who have honoured every term of their treaty with you and have not supported an enemy against you, honour your treaty with them until the end of its term. Surely Allah loves those who are mindful ˹of Him˺.
- 9:5 - But once the Sacred Months have passed, kill the polytheists ˹who violated their treaties˺ wherever you find them, capture them, besiege them, and lie in wait for them on every way. But if they repent, perform prayers, and pay alms-tax, then set them free. Indeed, Allah is All-Forgiving, Most Merciful. - — Dr. Mustafa Khattab, the Clear Quran
- Al-Baqarah 2:191- And kill them [in battle] wherever you overtake them and expel them from wherever they have expelled you, and fitnah is worse than killing. And do not fight them at al-Masjid al-Ḥarām until they fight you there. But if they fight you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers. - Saheeh International
- Al-Hajj 22:39 -
Allah has given permission to fight to the believers who are fought by the idolaters, due to their being oppressed by their enemies. Allah has the power to help the believers against their enemies without fighting. However, the wisdom of Allah required that the believers be tested through fighting the disbelievers. - Abridged Explanation of the Quran 2:194 - A sacred month for a sacred month: violation of sanctity [calls for] fair retribution. So if anyone commits aggression against you, attack him as he attacked you, but be mindful of God, and know that He is with those who are mindful of Him. Al-Hajj 22:39 - Those who have been attacked are permitted to take up arms because they have been wronged- God has the power to help them - 4:92 - It is unlawful for a believer to kill another believer, unless it occurs by mistake. If the victim was not a believer but belonged to a people with whom you have a treaty, such as disbelievers living in an Islamic state, the relatives of the killer, who inherit from him, will be responsible for blood money to be handed over to the successors of the victim and the killer must free a believing slave as compensation for his action. If he cannot find anyone to free or he cannot afford the price, then he must fast continuously for two consecutive months so that Allah accepts his repentance for what he has done. Allah knows the actions of His servants and their intentions; and He is Wise in His legislation and planning. - Abridged Explanation of the Quran
- "Whoever killed a Mu'ahid (a person who is granted the pledge of protection by the Muslims) shall not smell the fragrance of Paradise though its fragrance can be smelt at a distance of forty years (of traveling).” Source: Sahih Bukhari Vol. 9, Book 83, Hadith 49 – Sunnah.com
- "The protection granted by Muslims is one and must be respected by the humblest of them. And he who broke the covenant made by a Muslim, there is a curse of Allah, of his angels, and of the whole people upon him, and neither an obligatory act nor a supererogatory act would be accepted from him as recompense on the Day of Resurrection." Sahih Muslim, Book 7, Hadith 3167 - Sunnah.com
- “[w]hoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely.” (5:32 – Saheeh International translation)
- “And do not kill the soul which Allah has forbidden [to be killed] except by [legal] right. This has He instructed you that you may use reason." (6:151 - Saheeh International translation)
- “There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong.” (2:256 - Saheeh International translation)
- “And if they incline to peace, then incline to it [also] and rely upon Allah. Indeed, it is He who is the Hearing, the Knowing.” (8:61- Saheeh International translation)
- “O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm for Allah, witnesses in justice, and do not let the hatred of a people prevent you from being just. Be just; that is nearer to righteousness. And fear Allah; indeed, Allah is Acquainted with what you do.” (5:8 - Saheeh International translation)
- Quran states that if the enemies repent of their behavior and promise to fulfill their treaties, it becomes incumbent on Muslims to cease military action and forgive them. Unfortunately those who take this specific verse out of context fail to see that as the title Al-Taubah suggests, the main subject matter of the chapter is forgiveness and repentance.
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Ayesha12345678
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Posted: 21 May 2022 at 12:31pm |
1. What was man created from, blood, clay, dust, or nothing?- He created the human from a clot of congealed blood, after it had been a drop of semen. — Abridged Explanation of the Quran. Tafsir of this verse: ,,The word ` alaq, being the plural of 'alaqatun, means 'congealed blood'. The creation of man has passed and passes through various phases. the sperm which then transforms into congealed blood. This is the primary state of the embryo which happens after the conception. Then it takes the shape of a lump of flesh and then the skeletal structure is created. 'Alaqah is the middle phase in the whole process of creation. The specific mention of ` alaqah covers the initial stage and the final stage of the process of creation." - Maarif Ul Quran
I created Adam from dried clay, if it is struck it sounds. This clay that he was created from is black and of an altered scent beacuse of the duration it has been left. — Abridged Explanation of the Quran - Fatir 35:11 - And Allah did create you from dust; then from a sperm-drop; then He made you in pairs. And no female conceives, or lays down (her load), but with His knowledge. Nor is a man long-lived granted length of days, nor is a part cut off from his life, but is in a Decree (ordained). All this is easy to Allah.
- Al-Anbya 21:30 - Do the disbelievers not realize that the heavens and earth were ˹once˺ one mass then We split them apart? And We created from water every living thing. Will they not then believe?
- Ar-Rum 30:20 - Among His Signs in this, that He created you from dust; and then,- behold, ye are men scattered (far and wide)!
- Al-Kahf 18:37 - His companion said to him while he was conversing with him, "Have you disbelieved in He who created you from dust and then from a sperm-drop and then proportioned you [as] a man? / His believing friend said to him whilst having this conversation: Do you reject the One Who created your father, Adam, from dust. Then He created you from sperm. - abriged explanation of Quran
- Al-A'raf 7:12 - Allah asked Satan rebuking him: 'What stopped you from following My command to bow down to Adam?' Satan said: 'What prevented me is that I am better than Adam: You created me from fire and Adam from mud, and fire is greater then mud.'
- Al-Hijr 15:28 - Your Lord said to the angels, ‘I will create a mortal out of dried clay, formed from dark mud.
- Fatir 35:1 - Praise be to Allah, Who created (out of nothing) the heavens and the earth, Who made the angels, messengers with wings,- two, or three, or four (pairs): He adds to Creation as He pleases: for Allah has power over all things.
- Maryam 19:67 - But does not man call to mind that We created him before out of nothing?
- You is general word for humankind and first human was made out of nothing, because nothing existed till Allah created heavens and earth, then dust and water was created and forged, then it became mud and then dried as clay (you can look it up how clay or mud is made) and then Human. it is simple logic and you should read Quran as whole, which obviously you didn't when you create something and people ask you from what did you create, you dont need to tell whole process but say what ingredients you used, right? here it is same, but even more. if one verse is what you don't understand, you should read other verses too and it becomes clear.
2. is there or is there not compulsion in religion according to the Qur'an?- "Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things," (2:256).
- "And an announcement from Allah and His Messenger, to the people (assembled) on the day of the Great Pilgrimage,- that Allah and His Messenger dissolve (treaty) obligations with the Pagans. If then, ye repent, it were best for you; but if ye turn away, know ye that ye cannot frustrate Allah. And proclaim a grievous penalty to those who reject Faith," (9:3).
- This means that there is no compulsion in religion, because you have free will to choose between right and wrong but that doesn't mean that you won't be punished for doing wrong. choosing wrong is your decision and noone can force you and noone has right to force to choose right choice or even make you do wrong thing. for example, in country we have freedom of choice, freedom of speech, freedom of expressing one' s self, right of life, right of practicing one's religion, but that doesn't mean that if you express yourself by killing someone unjustly, or your religion tells you to kill innocent people for example for sacrifice (like ancient times), isn't it a crime? shouldn't we punish transgressors of law? yeah it is true, noone can force you to kill someone, even for religious purposes, because you have freedom of choice, free will to choose between right and wrong, but does that mean that you shouldn't be punished for killing someone unjustly? then where is justice? it was your choice to transgress the law and consequences were you being punished. Allah is the most Just. that is why punishment exists for transgressors in religion, but you will be good or bad is totally upto you. angels have no free will, they are have no other choice but to be good. you have that choice, but you are also responsible for your actions. again, simple logic.
- now about next two verses (3-4 in your list). lets see what whole Quran says about it and verses before it. because there are other verses regulating these verses. they cant be understood seperately.
- 9:4 - As for the polytheists who have honoured every term of their treaty with you and have not supported an enemy against you, honour your treaty with them until the end of its term. Surely Allah loves those who are mindful ˹of Him˺.
- 9:5 - But once the Sacred Months have passed, kill the polytheists ˹who violated their treaties˺ wherever you find them, capture them, besiege them, and lie in wait for them on every way. But if they repent, perform prayers, and pay alms-tax, then set them free. Indeed, Allah is All-Forgiving, Most Merciful. - — Dr. Mustafa Khattab, the Clear Quran
- Al-Baqarah 2:191- And kill them [in battle] wherever you overtake them and expel them from wherever they have expelled you, and fitnah is worse than killing. And do not fight them at al-Masjid al-Ḥarām until they fight you there. But if they fight you, then kill them. Such is the recompense of the disbelievers. - Saheeh International
- Al-Hajj 22:39 -
Allah has given permission to fight to the believers who are fought by the idolaters, due to their being oppressed by their enemies. Allah has the power to help the believers against their enemies without fighting. However, the wisdom of Allah required that the believers be tested through fighting the disbelievers. - Abridged Explanation of the Quran 2:194 - A sacred month for a sacred month: violation of sanctity [calls for] fair retribution. So if anyone commits aggression against you, attack him as he attacked you, but be mindful of God, and know that He is with those who are mindful of Him. Al-Hajj 22:39 - Those who have been attacked are permitted to take up arms because they have been wronged- God has the power to help them - 4:92 - It is unlawful for a believer to kill another believer, unless it occurs by mistake. If the victim was not a believer but belonged to a people with whom you have a treaty, such as disbelievers living in an Islamic state, the relatives of the killer, who inherit from him, will be responsible for blood money to be handed over to the successors of the victim and the killer must free a believing slave as compensation for his action. If he cannot find anyone to free or he cannot afford the price, then he must fast continuously for two consecutive months so that Allah accepts his repentance for what he has done. Allah knows the actions of His servants and their intentions; and He is Wise in His legislation and planning. - Abridged Explanation of the Quran
- "Whoever killed a Mu'ahid (a person who is granted the pledge of protection by the Muslims) shall not smell the fragrance of Paradise though its fragrance can be smelt at a distance of forty years (of traveling).” Source: Sahih Bukhari Vol. 9, Book 83, Hadith 49 – Sunnah.com
- "The protection granted by Muslims is one and must be respected by the humblest of them. And he who broke the covenant made by a Muslim, there is a curse of Allah, of his angels, and of the whole people upon him, and neither an obligatory act nor a supererogatory act would be accepted from him as recompense on the Day of Resurrection." Sahih Muslim, Book 7, Hadith 3167 - Sunnah.com
- “[w]hoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely.” (5:32 – Saheeh International translation)
- “And do not kill the soul which Allah has forbidden [to be killed] except by [legal] right. This has He instructed you that you may use reason." (6:151 - Saheeh International translation)
- “There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong.” (2:256 - Saheeh International translation)
- “And if they incline to peace, then incline to it [also] and rely upon Allah. Indeed, it is He who is the Hearing, the Knowing.” (8:61- Saheeh International translation)
- “O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm for Allah, witnesses in justice, and do not let the hatred of a people prevent you from being just. Be just; that is nearer to righteousness. And fear Allah; indeed, Allah is Acquainted with what you do.” (5:8 - Saheeh International translation)
- Quran states that if the enemies repent of their behavior and promise to fulfill their treaties, it becomes incumbent on Muslims to cease military action and forgive them. Unfortunately those who take this specific verse out of context fail to see that as the title Al-Taubah suggests, the main subject matter of the chapter is forgiveness and repentance.
3. The first Muslim was Muhammad? Abraham? Jacob? Moses?- First ever muslim was Adam (As).
- verses you said, there first to believe means ,,before preaching my message to you and tell you to submit to Allah, i should give example and should be first one among you to submit Allah". Even by reading it, you get same idea. unless you really want to say something against, you should have no problem understanding those verses like this.
4. Does Allah forgive or not forgive those who worship false gods?5. Are Allah's decrees changed or not? 6.Was Pharaoh killed or not killed by drowning? - even by the context of verses, you clearly can read that Pharaoh was drowned and killed. but his soulless body was kept so that it would be sign for generations to come. easy peasy.
7. Is wine consumption good or bad?- wine which is on earth is intoxicant, thus consumption is bad. Which will be in heaven, will be so pure that it wont have any intoxicant.
- Truly the Righteous will be in Bliss: On Thrones (of Dignity) will they command a sight (of all things): Thou wilt recognize in their faces the beaming brightness of Bliss. Their thirst will be slaked with Pure Wine sealed," (83:22-25).
- 52:23 - They will give to one another cups of wine, bearing no resemeblness to the wine of this world, free from intoxication and that which arises from it, such as false speech.
— Abridged Explanation of the Quran Al-Mutaffifin 83:25 - They will be given a drink of sealed, pure wine, - Dr. Mustafa Khattab, the Clear Quran Al-Waqi'ah 56:19 - that will cause them neither headache nor intoxication. — Dr. Mustafa Khattab, the Clear Quran 56:19- It is not like the wine of the world; it’s drinkers will not get headaches nor suffer intoxication. — Abridged Explanation of the Quran
I can easily say that you read Quran with biased mind and ignored many verses. Didn't even try to look for explanation of verses. I even doubt that you read Quran fully. Bible has serious contradictions. See this paper, called ,,101 contradictions of Bible" : https://drive.google.com/file/d/1-b5NFCAMMiRFPmxCdlk7Iguqm2EXJkm6/view?usp=sharing. Those contradiction are so severe that you can't explain in any way even by reading commentaries and explanation. May Allah guide you to straight path. Ameen
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defenders
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Posted: 13 April 2005 at 7:39am |
Shams Zaman wrote:
The Quran is the book of Wisdom and anyone who has no wisdom and who can't think he can only get the instructions and guidence. But a man with knowledge and wisdom will be boggled with its depth and meaning. Secondly Arabic is a very rather most powerful terrestial language and no translation can match of its word which carry extremely vast and deep meanings. That is the reason that a French Doctor Dr. Mauries Bokyle once wrote the his famous and best selling book "The Quran Bible and Science" he first learned Arabic for almost 13 years and then claimed that Quran does not even contain a single verse which contradicts the modren science. He wrote this book as a christian and I don't know whether he is still a Christian or not.
�(It is) a Book We have revealed to you is full of blessing that they may ponder over its revelations, and that those endowed with wisdom may seek advice�.38:29
�These are verses of the Book of Wisdom� 31:2
�Swearing by the Quran full of wisdom� 36:2
1. What was man created from, blood, clay, dust, or nothing?
If I say tea is prepared of water. Then I say tea is prepared from milk and then I say that tea is prepared from the tea leaves which statement is wrong? Of course all are true.
�Man was created from nothing�. This is to refute the Darwin theory that man has evolved. No sir man was created from nowhere because there was no specie existing with the name of man. So once man was created for the first time he was created from nowhere.
�The body of man was created from clay�. Dust is not right because clay is actually dust mixed with water. So Adam was the first creation from clay and then God spelled his soul in his body and he became human.
�Man was created from blood is not correct�. The Arabic word is �ALAKA� �clot like substance resembling leech� and we don�t have appropriate word for Alaka so we use the word clot of blood which is nearest. You can refer to Prof Keithal Moore a Thai Prof of embryology who says �How could Muhammad seen this in the womb and its only in 1970,s that we exactly discovered the same.� He admits that only a divine revelation can say this. So once man is in mother�s womb he is created or developed from a zygote which resembles a leech which can be confirmed from medical books.
2. Is there or is there not compulsion in religion according to the Qur'an?
There is no compulsion in religion. The sura which you have mentioned is 9 known as Tooba or Repentance. The first few verses were revealed once the non Muslim tribes had broken down the pact with Muslims of Medina. So it was a announcement of war for those who had broken the pact. Today this also holds good for all those who will not honour the pact and not for all non-Muslims. The exception can be seen in the same Sura in verse 6, �And if one of the idolaters seek protection from you, grant him protection till he hears the word of Allah, then escort him to a place of safety; this is because they are a people who do not know�. So these verses can not generally hold good for all non muslims but for only those who had broken a pact or have intentionally violated it. And anyone who is party to it and seeks for protection his treatment is given in the verse 6 of the same Sura. And nowhere Quran says convert someone forcibly.
3. The first Muslim was Muhammad? Abraham? Jacob? Moses?
Every Prophet is supposed to be the first Muslim in his nation. Adam was first Muslim as a Human, Abraham was the first Muslim in his nation, Moses in his and Muhammad was in his nation that is the Arabs initially and the rest of the world later. Once the last priest believing in Oneness of God died in Syria died Muhammad was given the Prophet hood. Hazrat Salaman Farsi who came from Persia fed up with the idol and fir worship he kept on going from one priest to another until the last and forth one told him that after my death there is none who believe in one God and so you should go to Arabia where the Prophet is expected to appear.
4. Does Allah forgive or not forgive those who worship false gods?
Allah does not forgive the sin of associating partners with Him until and unless one seeks for forgiveness and mercy. You have to follow the complete incident of Moses coming back from the Sena mount.
See 2 : 54 (Sura Baqra) �And when Moses said to his people: O my people! you have surely been unjust to yourselves by taking the calf (for a god), therefore turn to your Creator (penitently), so kill your people, that is best for you with your Creator: so He turned to you (mercifully), for surely He is the Oft-returning (to mercy), the Merciful� So all those who were the perpetrators and who did not repent were killed. But those were forgiven who repented before Moses had returned to them. This event is also given in Old Testament Exodus Ch 32, verses 1 � 29 which says that almost 3000 were killed.
5. Are Allah's decrees changed or not?
Allah�s decrees never contradicts and no one can alter Allah�s commands except for Him alone. Like once we seeks for repentance or forgiveness Allah changes his decree from punishment to forgiveness. Secondly none of the decree given in Quran which was later altered contradicts. Like once Allah says don�t offer prayers once you are intoxicated, and later we are told that wine is forbidden and is Satanic. Does it contradict? The first order is still valid.
6. Was Pharaoh killed or not killed by drowning?
Indeed Pharoah was drowned with all his men narrated at numerous places in Quran. While his Mummy or body was made example and was discovered in the early 20th century. Probably in 1917 and still lies preserved in Egyptian museum in Cairo. It was recently shown on Discovery channel on 4th April 2005 in a documentary. Rather till 1900 the other religion people used to say this is the prophecy which is still unfulfilled in Quran
And now its not possible to find the Pharaoh who had drowned and eaten by fish etc. But the Prophecy came true and his body was found with a thick salt layer on it still lying preserved.
7. Is wine consumption good or bad?
The wine is not only bad for humans but is also haram (forbidden). But it does contain a benefit. It gives you pleasure and a false sense of security and this is the reason that once a man in deep despair drinks it he forgets his miseries. So expect for these two benefits it has all the evil properties. So both were described in Quran.
Regarding the other Questions, I would ask you some simple questions:
1. Once you say, the God i worship never reveals himself in one "pure" language...but has translated his word in ALL languages of everytonge...so all nations need NOT learn one language (arabic) in order to pray to him. Do want to say that infact God revealed Bible in all these different languages? Well if that is what you say you are an ignorant Christian who does not know in which language it was revealed. It was revealed in Hebrew and some say in Greek. Regarding its translations the Quran has been translated in same number of languages as of Bible. But unfortunately no where we find the original scripture of Bible and God knows what all non sense has been included in Bible which is even not appropriate to quote here. �Bast--d� This word or abuse occurs in the Bible THREE times DEUTERONOMY 23:2, ZECHARIAH 9:6 and HEBREWS 12:8. Incest (s-x-al relationship between close relations like brother-sisters, father-daughter etc) GENESIS 19:33-35 (Prophet Lot and his daughters). Can you believe that well if you do shame on you. Jacob�s son (Reuben) with his step mother GENESIS 35:22. And between brother and sister SAMUEL-2, 13 : 5-14. What is this nonsense?
2. And once you say that the god i worship does not tell us to pray in a certain direction (first towards jerusalem) and then change his mind to (Mecca). So let me ask how do you pray? Do you think that there were no instructions for Jewes and Christians? If you could read the Three chapters of Old Testement you will come to know what it contains for you. Just read Exodus and Leviticus. And if these instructions were not meant to be followed why were they given to you then? As to why the direction was changed because before the Children of Ismael or the Ismaelites the Jews were the Ummah or the divine nation. They like Jesus denied the Prophet hood of Muhammad but were given a time to accept Muhammad as their awaited Prophet or the Messiah. But they didn�t so the divine honor to worship in the direction of Jerusalem was taken away. Kabba denotes the unity of Muslim nation and that they all worship One and Only God, thus they face one direction to represent that there is only one centre and that is One God. Therefore you can�t face one direction as you consider 3 gods and confuse it One God. How can be there one centre for you?
3. So once you say that, the god i worship does not put a tax on unbelievers such as Jazya. This is misconception that only non- Muslims are to pay. Muslims are supposed to pay Zakat and non Muslims the jazya. Don�t you pay tax in America, Britain or any other part of the world? We all pay tax and so is the system in Islamic society, what�s the big deal about it. And if you don�t want to pay Jazya go to some other country, like of if you don�t want to pay tax in America go to some other country. I hope you will land on moon while looking for such a place.
4. Salat (prayers), Fasting etc are the rituals which were made must for every nation and society by God, whether be Jews, Christians or any other. So if you don�t perform them you are free to do that but you will be held answerable in the hereafter. However Hajj was mandatory for the last Muslim nation.
5. Nowhere the Quran or Hadith tells us to seek guidance from Anjeel or Torah. It tells that these were the revelations from God and their people on whom they were sent altered it not accidentally but intentionally and for a very small benefit but ultimately will be rewarded in eternal hell. �Do you then hope that they would believe in you, and a party from among them indeed used to hear the Word of Allah, then altered it after they had understood it, and they know (this) o And when they meet those who believe they say: We believe, and when they are alone one with another they say: Do you talk to them of what Allah has disclosed to you that they may contend with you by this before your Lord? Do you not then understand? o Do they not know that Allah knows what they keep secret and what they make known? o And there are among them illiterates who know not the Book but only lies, and they do but conjecture o Woe, then, to those who write the book with their hands and then say: This is from Allah, so that they may take for it a small price; therefore woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for what they earn o�(Sura Bakra-2, verse 75-79).
Shams Zaman Pakistan
[email protected]
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Assalammu'alaikum br Shams Zaman.
Good work.
Mostly, people who refer the qur'an contradiction will never comeback after Muslims fight back.
So far not even a single word coming from mr tawhid. Where is he?
wassalammu'alaikum
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Shams Zaman
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Posted: 13 April 2005 at 5:28am |
The Quran is the book of Wisdom and anyone who has no wisdom and who can't think he can only get the instructions and guidence. But a man with knowledge and wisdom will be boggled with its depth and meaning. Secondly Arabic is a very rather most powerful terrestial language and no translation can match of its word which carry extremely vast and deep meanings. That is the reason that a French Doctor Dr. Mauries Bokyle once wrote the his famous and best selling book "The Quran Bible and Science" he first learned Arabic for almost 13 years and then claimed that Quran does not even contain a single verse which contradicts the modren science. He wrote this book as a christian and I don't know whether he is still a Christian or not.
�(It is) a Book We have revealed to you is full of blessing that they may ponder over its revelations, and that those endowed with wisdom may seek advice�.38:29
�These are verses of the Book of Wisdom� 31:2
�Swearing by the Quran full of wisdom� 36:2
1. What was man created from, blood, clay, dust, or nothing?
If I say tea is prepared of water. Then I say tea is prepared from milk and then I say that tea is prepared from the tea leaves which statement is wrong? Of course all are true.
�Man was created from nothing�. This is to refute the Darwin theory that man has evolved. No sir man was created from nowhere because there was no specie existing with the name of man. So once man was created for the first time he was created from nowhere.
�The body of man was created from clay�. Dust is not right because clay is actually dust mixed with water. So Adam was the first creation from clay and then God spelled his soul in his body and he became human.
�Man was created from blood is not correct�. The Arabic word is �ALAKA� �clot like substance resembling leech� and we don�t have appropriate word for Alaka so we use the word clot of blood which is nearest. You can refer to Prof Keithal Moore a Thai Prof of embryology who says �How could Muhammad seen this in the womb and its only in 1970,s that we exactly discovered the same.� He admits that only a divine revelation can say this. So once man is in mother�s womb he is created or developed from a zygote which resembles a leech which can be confirmed from medical books.
2. Is there or is there not compulsion in religion according to the Qur'an?
There is no compulsion in religion. The sura which you have mentioned is 9 known as Tooba or Repentance. The first few verses were revealed once the non Muslim tribes had broken down the pact with Muslims of Medina. So it was a announcement of war for those who had broken the pact. Today this also holds good for all those who will not honour the pact and not for all non-Muslims. The exception can be seen in the same Sura in verse 6, �And if one of the idolaters seek protection from you, grant him protection till he hears the word of Allah, then escort him to a place of safety; this is because they are a people who do not know�. So these verses can not generally hold good for all non muslims but for only those who had broken a pact or have intentionally violated it. And anyone who is party to it and seeks for protection his treatment is given in the verse 6 of the same Sura. And nowhere Quran says convert someone forcibly.
3. The first Muslim was Muhammad? Abraham? Jacob? Moses?
Every Prophet is supposed to be the first Muslim in his nation. Adam was first Muslim as a Human, Abraham was the first Muslim in his nation, Moses in his and Muhammad was in his nation that is the Arabs initially and the rest of the world later. Once the last priest believing in Oneness of God died in Syria died Muhammad was given the Prophet hood. Hazrat Salaman Farsi who came from Persia fed up with the idol and fir worship he kept on going from one priest to another until the last and forth one told him that after my death there is none who believe in one God and so you should go to Arabia where the Prophet is expected to appear.
4. Does Allah forgive or not forgive those who worship false gods?
Allah does not forgive the sin of associating partners with Him until and unless one seeks for forgiveness and mercy. You have to follow the complete incident of Moses coming back from the Sena mount.
See 2 : 54 (Sura Baqra) �And when Moses said to his people: O my people! you have surely been unjust to yourselves by taking the calf (for a god), therefore turn to your Creator (penitently), so kill your people, that is best for you with your Creator: so He turned to you (mercifully), for surely He is the Oft-returning (to mercy), the Merciful� So all those who were the perpetrators and who did not repent were killed. But those were forgiven who repented before Moses had returned to them. This event is also given in Old Testament Exodus Ch 32, verses 1 � 29 which says that almost 3000 were killed.
5. Are Allah's decrees changed or not?
Allah�s decrees never contradicts and no one can alter Allah�s commands except for Him alone. Like once we seeks for repentance or forgiveness Allah changes his decree from punishment to forgiveness. Secondly none of the decree given in Quran which was later altered contradicts. Like once Allah says don�t offer prayers once you are intoxicated, and later we are told that wine is forbidden and is Satanic. Does it contradict? The first order is still valid.
6. Was Pharaoh killed or not killed by drowning?
Indeed Pharoah was drowned with all his men narrated at numerous places in Quran. While his Mummy or body was made example and was discovered in the early 20th century. Probably in 1917 and still lies preserved in Egyptian museum in Cairo. It was recently shown on Discovery channel on 4th April 2005 in a documentary. Rather till 1900 the other religion people used to say this is the prophecy which is still unfulfilled in Quran
And now its not possible to find the Pharaoh who had drowned and eaten by fish etc. But the Prophecy came true and his body was found with a thick salt layer on it still lying preserved.
7. Is wine consumption good or bad?
The wine is not only bad for humans but is also haram (forbidden). But it does contain a benefit. It gives you pleasure and a false sense of security and this is the reason that once a man in deep despair drinks it he forgets his miseries. So expect for these two benefits it has all the evil properties. So both were described in Quran.
Regarding the other Questions, I would ask you some simple questions:
1. Once you say, the God i worship never reveals himself in one "pure" language...but has translated his word in ALL languages of everytonge...so all nations need NOT learn one language (arabic) in order to pray to him. Do want to say that infact God revealed Bible in all these different languages? Well if that is what you say you are an ignorant Christian who does not know in which language it was revealed. It was revealed in Hebrew and some say in Greek. Regarding its translations the Quran has been translated in same number of languages as of Bible. But unfortunately no where we find the original scripture of Bible and God knows what all non sense has been included in Bible which is even not appropriate to quote here. �Bast--d� This word or abuse occurs in the Bible THREE times DEUTERONOMY 23:2, ZECHARIAH 9:6 and HEBREWS 12:8. Incest (s-x-al relationship between close relations like brother-sisters, father-daughter etc) GENESIS 19:33-35 (Prophet Lot and his daughters). Can you believe that well if you do shame on you. Jacob�s son (Reuben) with his step mother GENESIS 35:22. And between brother and sister SAMUEL-2, 13 : 5-14. What is this nonsense?
2. And once you say that the god i worship does not tell us to pray in a certain direction (first towards jerusalem) and then change his mind to (Mecca). So let me ask how do you pray? Do you think that there were no instructions for Jewes and Christians? If you could read the Three chapters of Old Testement you will come to know what it contains for you. Just read Exodus and Leviticus. And if these instructions were not meant to be followed why were they given to you then? As to why the direction was changed because before the Children of Ismael or the Ismaelites the Jews were the Ummah or the divine nation. They like Jesus denied the Prophet hood of Muhammad but were given a time to accept Muhammad as their awaited Prophet or the Messiah. But they didn�t so the divine honor to worship in the direction of Jerusalem was taken away. Kabba denotes the unity of Muslim nation and that they all worship One and Only God, thus they face one direction to represent that there is only one centre and that is One God. Therefore you can�t face one direction as you consider 3 gods and confuse it One God. How can be there one centre for you?
3. So once you say that, the god i worship does not put a tax on unbelievers such as Jazya. This is misconception that only non- Muslims are to pay. Muslims are supposed to pay Zakat and non Muslims the jazya. Don�t you pay tax in America, Britain or any other part of the world? We all pay tax and so is the system in Islamic society, what�s the big deal about it. And if you don�t want to pay Jazya go to some other country, like of if you don�t want to pay tax in America go to some other country. I hope you will land on moon while looking for such a place.
4. Salat (prayers), Fasting etc are the rituals which were made must for every nation and society by God, whether be Jews, Christians or any other. So if you don�t perform them you are free to do that but you will be held answerable in the hereafter. However Hajj was mandatory for the last Muslim nation.
5. Nowhere the Quran or Hadith tells us to seek guidance from Anjeel or Torah. It tells that these were the revelations from God and their people on whom they were sent altered it not accidentally but intentionally and for a very small benefit but ultimately will be rewarded in eternal hell. �Do you then hope that they would believe in you, and a party from among them indeed used to hear the Word of Allah, then altered it after they had understood it, and they know (this) o And when they meet those who believe they say: We believe, and when they are alone one with another they say: Do you talk to them of what Allah has disclosed to you that they may contend with you by this before your Lord? Do you not then understand? o Do they not know that Allah knows what they keep secret and what they make known? o And there are among them illiterates who know not the Book but only lies, and they do but conjecture o Woe, then, to those who write the book with their hands and then say: This is from Allah, so that they may take for it a small price; therefore woe to them for what their hands have written and woe to them for what they earn o�(Sura Bakra-2, verse 75-79).
Shams Zaman Pakistan
[email protected]
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Posted: 12 April 2005 at 3:04am |
Dear Tawhid. Let us back to the discussion about contradiction.
If you can't response my refutation on your copy and paste contradiction, that's mean you are fail at least one point about human creation. You have to admit that point 1. is not a contradiction.
After you response, I'll be ready for other claims inshaALLAH.
I'll wait.
Salaam
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semar
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Posted: 11 April 2005 at 4:50pm |
tawhid wrote:
the bible has been corrupted...a muslim says "yes"....
i ask...when?
was it after the quran was formulated - AFTER your prophet said that the enjeels were from God?
or before? serpents
by who? when? how can God's enjeels be corrupted if they were from God almighty? how can a simple human corrupt the divine word of God?
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You have not answered AhmedJoiya's question yet.
Anyway I'll answer some of your simple questions. No written injeel is free corruption. All had been corrupted since the injeel was written. Because the authors were not genuine peoples who love and fear God, some even Prophet Jesus's enemy. Of course before the quran was formulated. The quran's content was not based from any books or any human writing but came from God directly.
There is no God's promise to maintain/protect the Injeel, because God had an intention to release the new version of injeel, that is Quran.
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Salam/Peace,
Semar
"We are people who do not eat until we are hungry and do not eat to our fill." (Prophet Muhammad PBUH)
"1/3 of your stomach for food, 1/3 for water, 1/3 for air"
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