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bmz - i do not believe you have properly addressed this previous part of a post of mine (you are black, i am red):

"Regarding Adam and Eve, we know that they did not commit any sin. All they did was to eat a forbidden fruit of a particular tree.

which God had forbidden them to do.  so according to the great islamic logic we hear so much about, you can disobey God, and still not sin

They did not make love in the garden.

what rubbish is this.  what has making love got to do with any of this?

The fact is that Satan tricked them into committing that mistake.

of course he did.  and they had been warned in advance (according to the quran)  but he did not make the "mistake" for them.  they made it themselves, and sinned.

Later, both realised, asked for God's forgiveness and were forgiven.

why would they have to be forgiven if they had not sinned?  why would they say "we are surely among the lost" if they had not sinned? 

It's just as simple as that. Qur'aan keeps it simple and more factual and it does not blame the woman or the man. It just says that both made that mistake.

yes, as simplistic as that.  so who sinned?  satan (iblis) was condemned because he refused to sin by bowing down and worshipping the creation rather than the creator, and adam and eve disobeyed God, but did not sin, and were nonetheless forgiven for a sin they did not commit"

also, are you saying that animals are sacrificed, in islam, for sin?

you know, bmz, ive always had the sneaking suspicion that allah was soft on sin, requiring no sacrifice for it, just waving it aside as if it wasnt important.  if anything indicates that we dont worship the same God, then this is it i would say

why, in your illustration, are you comparing allah to a father.  is allah you father?

they did not disobey God?

 actually i think this threads about run its course, (ive been rereading it, and we are repeating ourselves)so unless mish or anyone has anything new to add.....

So, if God's purpose was to have man with Him eternally, once again, why not just destroy Adam and Eve and start over? They are the two who messed everything up.

According to you, man alone can never be acceptible to God, we can only be accepted through Jesus. So, we, mankind, could never truly fulfill our purpose anyway. Only Jesus can fulfill that purpose for us. So, once again, why are men here?

Yes, God put a sinner on earth deliberately. Don't you believe He expelled Adam and Eve from Eden to live on earth out of the Garden, deliberately? God could have done many things with them, but He didn't. He didn't expel them from the Garden by accident.

You say we are guilty of our sins, but do you really believe we are being punished for our sins alone? We are all banished from Eden and the presence of God, according to you man's rightful place, because of the sin of Adam and Eve. Therefore, all men are being punished for their sin. According to you, men were never meant to sin, yet once Adam and Eve sinned, all men were born into a sin they did not commit. Once again, being punished for the sin of Adam and Eve.

You can rebel against the Will of God, but you cannot do anything unless God permits it. Even when we rebel, God allows us to do so. If God did not allow it, it could not happen. Even Satan could not exist unless God allows him to do so.

Fred, you're not trying to say that things went so awry with Adam and Eve that God lost control and now whatever happens on earth is out of His control? That things happen on earth that God never meant to happen?

"correct me if im wrong, but my information is that the "internal jihad" is a hadith thing, not a quran thing.  therefore according to you it is written by men and not by God.  the "internal jihad" is a myth"

Don't misunderstand. If there is a Hadith about a matter, unless it is a weak Hadith or contradicts the Quran, then it should be accepted. The difference between the Quran and the Hadith are that the Quran is the direct Word of God, the Hadith are the words, deeds, and actions of the Prophet Mohammed recorded by men. Much like the Gospels According to... 

Of course internal jihad exists. It is what keeps everyone who believes in God striving and struggling to follow His Laws. Please stand corrected.

Al-jahd: exertion or struggle, to strive

25:52 hence, do not defer to [the likes and dislikes of] those who deny the truth, but strive hard against them, by means of this [divine writ], with utmost striving.

49:15 [Know that true] believers are only those who have attained to faith in God and His Apostle and have left all doubt behind, <>Asad(49,19)   and who strive hard in God�s cause with their possessions and their lives: it is they, they who are true to their word!

2:218 Verily, they who have attained to faith, and they who have forsaken the domain of evil <>Asad(2,203)   and are striving hard in God's cause - these it is who may look forward to God's grace: for God is much-forgiving, a dispenser of grace.