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God�s commands |
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believer 
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Joined: 08 January 2008 Status: Offline Points: 1397 |
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 Posted: 20 April 2008 at 5:39pm |
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LOL!! I knew you would jump on that one. If a person takes the time and effort to study and read the Bible with an open heart there are no contradictions.
GOD makes His own rules. HE is so HOLY. We are talking all sins hear not just minor, any way how does one measure how major or minor sins are?
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John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. |
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Ron Webb
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Male atheist Joined: 30 January 2008 Location: Ottawa, Canada Status: Offline Points: 2467 |
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Posted: 20 April 2008 at 6:38pm |
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But you just mentioned a clear contradiction yourself, believer -- two contradicting genealogies of Jesus.
I think most people understand intuitively that some sins are more serious than others. God, on the other hand, apparently does not. Surely a just God would not decree that all sins deserve death?
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Ron Webb
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Posted: 20 April 2008 at 7:42pm |
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Just to be fair, though, the Bible isn't the only scripture with contradictions. In another discussion Shasta's Aunt mentioned "shirk" as the one unforgivable sin:
And yet, Allah did indeed forgive this sin at least once:
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Shasta'sAunt
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Posted: 20 April 2008 at 10:17pm |
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"The people of the Book ask thee to cause a book to descend to them from heaven: Indeed they asked Moses for an even greater (miracle), for they said: "Show us Allah in public," but they were dazed for their presumption, with thunder and lightning. Yet they worshipped the calf even after clear signs had come to them; even so we forgave them; and gave Moses manifest proofs of authority." [an-Nisaa� 4:153]
God will not punish you for something that you do not know. Moses knew that there was only One True God, but most of those he led out of Egypt did not. They were still in a state of disbelief and learning. If they sinned in ignorance and then repented in sincerity why wouldn't God forgive them?
Bringing change in a belief system is not an easy thing. The revelation of the Holy Quran took 23 years. Not because Allah could not have sent it faster, but because it takes men time to accept and understand the truth. Edited by Shasta'sAunt - 20 April 2008 at 10:26pm |
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�No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.�
Eleanor Roosevelt |
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minuteman
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Posted: 20 April 2008 at 10:36pm |
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For Ron, please note that Allah will not forgive any one who dies as a pagan. If one repents and discards the idol worship etc. (i..e Shirk) then that is forgiven. But any one remains a polytheist and dies as such, he will not be forgiven. That is the meaning. There is no contradiction in the Quran.
It is true that Allah forgave the Israelis even after their worship of the calf when they repented. That is all correct and Shasta'sAunt has given a good reply about all that.
I may add as a further proof of the same. All the companions of the prophet s.a.w.s. were polytheists (Mushrik), Hazrat Umar being a great one of them. And so many others, had all been a ploytheist once. But they were no more and nothing of that was to be remembered. That is the teaching of Islam. It does not mean that any one who did Shirk even once that he will never be forgiven even if he had said good-bye to it. That is not correct.
Shirk indeed is the greatest sin, the greatest injustice to God and to the person himslef. It will be punished severely if one does not repent. Allah is a jealous God (as it is said in the Torah too). He does not like that we make partners with him. I hope I have not said anything wrong.
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Ron Webb
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Posted: 21 April 2008 at 4:52pm |
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They were not in ignorance. They "worshipped the calf even after clear signs had come to them."
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Ron Webb
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Posted: 21 April 2008 at 5:07pm |
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There is no mention of repentance in sura 4:48. It clearly and simply says "Verily, Allaah forgives not that partners should be set up with Him (in worship)." Anyway, if Allah was willing to forgive the sin of Shirk after repentance, how would that make it different from any other sin? Surely Allah is merciful and forgives all sins (or at least "(anything else) to whom He wills") if we sincerely repent.
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Shasta'sAunt
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Posted: 21 April 2008 at 5:10pm |
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The clear signs of Moses being a magician. That is what they understood. These people were idol worshippers and pagans. Very few of them believed in One God. They followed Moses, not God, because he offered them freedom and he could perform magic/miracles, which they had seen but didn't really understand as the work of God. As soon as Moses disappeared for a few days, they went back to their old ways. They didn't fully understand, so how could they be held accountable?
If someone is a pagan or idol worshipper, then comes to believe in Islam, God will not hold their old beliefs against them. They were in a state of ignorance, even though they see the clear signs of God everywhere.
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�No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.�
Eleanor Roosevelt |
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