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18th question about islam
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Saladin View Drop Down
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Points: 575 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Saladin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2008 at 1:56am
Ron,
 
In an Islamic state, punishment for crimes come only after the paths leading to crimes are closed. eg. A hungry man stealing bread to eat doesnt warrant a punishment. Its the responsibility of the state to have made the man able to feed himself and meet his basic needs. 
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'
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Tariq View Drop Down
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Points: 50 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tariq Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2008 at 4:29am

BISMILLAH HIR RAHMAN NIR RAHIM

After all the issues of do deeds and misdeeds and forgiving them and punishing them it is common to found in every society but how to maintain a society requires some conditions to be met. And i think the war on terror in Iraq and afghanistan is an example for the world although they got nothing from there but still the matter is clear that west wants to stop terrorism and for that purpose they are simply KILLING.

I hope no body minds
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Points: 50 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tariq Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2008 at 4:53am
Assalam ao alaiqum  wa rahmatullah
 
After all the fars and hope from allah , as some follow the right path by fear and some follow with hope, some dont follow at all
But there is one group , community of believers who follows allah and his prophets with love and it is very sooner when they are deprived of feeling and concept of hope and fear they dont care whether theyr friend and love throw them in hell fire or in paradise their only mission and  objective i s only Allah and his team of who he loves.
 
THIS IS ENTIRELY A DIFFERENT THINKING TO THOSE WHO NEVER WANTED TO OBEY ALLAH WITH LOVE BECAUSE THEY ARE AGREED UPON TH UNWORTHY PERISHABLE LIFE OF DUNYA
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Ron Webb View Drop Down
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Points: 2467 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 May 2008 at 6:09pm

Assalamu alaikum Saladin,

Originally posted by Saladin Saladin wrote:

In an Islamic state, punishment for crimes come only after the paths leading to crimes are closed. eg. A hungry man stealing bread to eat doesnt warrant a punishment.

Does the Quran say that somewhere?
 
Quote Its the responsibility of the state to have made the man able to feed himself and meet his basic needs. 
 
And is that in the Quran?
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honeto View Drop Down
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Points: 2487 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote honeto Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 May 2008 at 4:28pm
Originally posted by Ron Webb Ron Webb wrote:

Originally posted by Tariq Tariq wrote:

The non-Muslim may say, �Chopping off the hands in this 20th century. Islam is a barbaric and ruthless religion!� 
That is exactly what I say; and the fact that it may reduce crime does not make it any less barbaric and ruthless.  Even without any other evidence, the cruelty throughout the Quran is enough to convince me that it did not come from a loving God.
 
I would much, much prefer to be robbed on a regular basis than to have a single thief mutilated in this way.  Frankly, I am astonished that Islam teaches that possessions are more important than mercy and forgiveness.
 
Ron,
starange enough that in my study of the Bible, I find your lord giving the same command that you seem to have problem with when a Muslim says it. And Jesus was a Muslim by faith, as he submitted to the will of the "Father" God. 1 John 2:17The world and its desires pass away, but the man who does the will of God lives forever.
Please read along:
Matthew 5:30
And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to go into hell.

Hasan 




Edited by honeto - 17 May 2008 at 4:29pm
The friends of God will certainly have nothing to fear, nor will they be grieved. Al Quran 10:62
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Ron Webb View Drop Down
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Points: 2467 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 May 2008 at 11:26am
Hasan, if you can't see the difference between Matthew's clearly figurative comment about cutting of one's own hands, and the Quran's clearly literal punishment of cutting off someone else's hands, then I don't think anything I could say would help you.
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Points: 50 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tariq Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 May 2008 at 3:43pm

WAILAIQUM US SALAM,

The answer for maintaing economical and financial matters of society for every person especially for poor persons, Islam obligated muslims to pay charity that is called zakat which is obligatory to every muslim who has eligibility to pay it , and then second is sadaqa which is also  a form of charity which recommend after obligation . If some one wants references so just read first verses of surah baqra chapter 2 of quran and there are several places where quran has emphasized on this matter.

Regarding stealing , so it is stealing but hudood laws or in which cutting of hand has certain conditions first the thing should be cost worthy of atleast 3  dirham  and to some scholar it is 10 dirham it is as amount which is calculated according to the  ratio of the value of different times.
After that it has other conditions too, which had been mentioned in previous posts.
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Ron Webb View Drop Down
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Points: 2467 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 May 2008 at 4:48pm
Ten Dirham (UAE) = $2.70 (Canadian) at present exchange rates.  I paid more than that last week for a fancy cup of coffee.  Tariq, would you really cut off a person's hands for that!? Shocked
 
By the way, can you give me any evidence for these conditions in the Quran?  Did these conditions come for Allah, or from men?


Edited by Ron Webb - 18 May 2008 at 4:50pm
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