Hmmmmm!

Bismillah ir rahman ir rahim,

Brother Ibn Hanbal, Assalamulaiakum wa rahmatullah wa barkatuhu,

Most of the ppl on the boards have decided not to engage in a dialogue with this person. You  r not too far from being called a zionist or something to that effect.

All over the boards he has been disrespecting muslims and nonmuslims alike. And from the horse's mouth, this loud mouth was a moderator on a wahabi website .... not a big surprise.

Thus as an advise save your breath, and move on to some useful conversation, insha allah.

Maa salaama,

Nausheen

I have not read all 1000+ postings, however, I would like to particpate any. I hope this was not already said.

I am an American re-vert to Islam (originally a Christian until the age of 21). I say this to establish that I have not been indoctrinated into any particular Islamic school of thought, and I beleive that Allah (S.W.A.) would not impose on us anything that did not make sense. This is the main reason for leaving the faith of my birth and the vast majority of my family members.

I have done quite a bit of research regarding the Sunni-Shia issue, and I am firmly convinced that the Shia are correct. When I say correct, let me explain (in part) what I mean. It is clear to me that;

1.) The Prophet Muhammad (A.S.) nominated Imam Ali ibn Abu Talib (A.S.) as his successor at least 3 times during his life in a clear an unmistakeable fashion. There are numerous sources in both Sunni and (of course) Shia books. I am amazed that my Sunni brothers and sisters consistently deny this when it is so clear, obvious and rational.

2.) The Sunni arguments against the Shia seem to revolve around the fact that the Shia are insulting to the companions of the Holy Messenger and some of his wives (such as Aisha). Please read your own books and you will find that some of the companions were good, and some of them were evil. Muawiya is considered a companion of the Prophet, and yet he attacked with military force the (according to Sunni's) fourth of the rightly guided caliphs on numerous occassions. Aisha also attacked Imam Ali (A.S.) in battle in the battle of the Camel (which is recorded in all Sunni books) along with Talah and Zubair (also companions). Being in open rebellion against the caliphate is a clear sin. Is this not the Sunni veiwpoint?

There are many other things I could say in this vein, however, I wish to keep it short and wait for a respons.  

Salam

" Can you please present where the Prophet(saw) in clear and unmistakable terms have appointed Ali(ra) as next caliph"

You have asked my all time favorite question! Thank you!

I just wrote this on a different posting, but I will repeat it here.

Regarding the first point.

The First Time

" When the verse: "And warn thy nearest relations (26:214), was revealed, the Prophet ordered 'Ali to prepare food and invite the sons of 'Abdu'l-Muttalib so that he could convey to them the words of Allah. After the feast, the Prophet intended to talk to them, but Abu Lahab interfered by saying:"Verily, your comrade has entranced you". Upon hearing this statement all of them dispersed.

The next day, the Messenger of Allah again called them for a feast. After they had finished with their food, the Prophet addressed them: "O sons of 'Abdul'l-Muttalib, I have brought for you the good of this world and the next, and I have been appointed by the Lord to call you unto Him. Therefore, who amongst you will administer this cause for me and be my brother, my successor and my caliph?" No one responded to the Prophet' s call except 'Ali who was the youngest of the congregation. The Prophet then patted 'Ali's neck and said: "O my people! This 'A1i is my brother, my successor and my caliph amongst you. Listen to him and obey him.'' [16] "

The Second Time

" Abu Dharr al-Ghifari says that one day he was praying with the Prophet when a beggar came to the Prophet's mosque. No one responded to his pleas. The beggar raised his hands towards heavens and said, "Allah! be a witness that I came to Thy Prophet's mosque and no one gave me anything". 'Ali (as) was bowing in ruku' at that time. He pointed his little finger, on which was a ring, towards the beggar who came forward and took away the ring. This incident occurred in the Prophet's presence who raised his face towards heaven and prayed: "O Lord! my brother Musa had begged of Thee to open his breast and to make his work easy for him, to loose the knot of his tongue so that people might understand him, and to appoint from among his relations his brother, as his vizier, and to strengthen his back with Harun and to make Harun his partner in his work. O Allah! Thou said to Musa, 'We will strengthen thy arm with thy brother. No one will now have an access to either of you!' O Allah! I am Muhammad and Thou hast given me distinction. Open my breast for me, make my work easy for me, and from my family appoint my brother 'Ali as my vizier. Strengthen my back with him". The Prophet had not yet finished his prayers when Jibril brought the above quoted verse. [17] "

The Third Time

Ghadir Khumm lies in Juhfa between Mecca and Medina. When the Prophet was on his way home, after performing his last pilgrimage, Jibril brought him this urgent command of Allah:

O Apostle! deliver what has been sent down to you from your Lord; and if you do it not, then you have not delivered His message (at all); and Allah will protect you from the people . . . (5 :67)

The Prophet stopped at once and ordered that all people who had gone ahead should be called back, and he waited for those who were following. When all the caravan had gathered, a pulpit was set up by piling up camel saddles; the acacia thorns were swept away. The Prophet ascended the pulpit and delivered a long sermon. The day was very hot; people had to stretch their cloaks under their feet and over their heads. The Prophet addressed them as follows: O you people! Know it well that Jibril came down to me several times bringing me orders from the Lord, the Merciful, that I should halt at this place and inform every man, white and black, that 'Ali, the son of Abu Talib, is my brother and my wasiyy (successor) and my caliph, and the Imam after me. His position to me is like that of Harun to Musa, except that there is to be no prophet after me, and he is your master next to Allah and His Prophet. "

ALSO:

The Messenger of Allah said to Ali: "Your position to me is like the
     position of Aaron (Haroon) to Moses, except that there shall be no
     Prophet after me"
                                    |     : |. .         .      .. .  |
        _w q_o    . _o    .  q   |_8   4_| _,_o_,     _,_o  ,__,_, |
     (_S   /     (_)     (_) / /          /    .   (_S

                                                   .   | |   .  |  | ||
                                        ]_e_,    _,_,  |_|  4_, |  |_||
                                    (_S    .  (_S.
Sunni References:
(1) Sahih al-Bukhari, Arabic-English version, Traditions 5.56, 5.700
(2) Sahih Muslim, Arabic, v4, pp 1870-71
(3) Sunan Ibn Majah, p12
(4) Musnad Ahmad Ibn Hanbal, v1, p174
(5) al-Khasa'is, by al-Nisa'i, pp 15-16
(6) Mushkil al-Athar, by al-Tahawi, v2, p309

See: http://al-islam.org/imamate/

Go to the above website for the complete list of sources.

SEE ALSO

http://www.al-islam.org/ask/ (written by a former Sunni scholar)

OR, if you have a little time, this will certainly be sufficient

http://al-islam.org/murajaat/index.htm

If, by " it all started with Uthman ibn affans(ra) death and hes killers." you are implying that Imam Ali(A.S.) had something to do with the assasination of Uthman (as Muawiya ibn abu Suffian did)  then please present your evidence for this.

In his famous collection of speechs, "Nagul Balagha", Imam Ali says in sermon 22 about those who accussed him of participating or sactioning the killing of Uthman

" Beware! Satan has certainly started instigating his forces and has collected his army in order that oppression may reach its extreme ends and wrong may come back to its position. By Allah they have not put a correct blame on me, nor have they done justice between me and themselves.

They are demanding of me a right which they have abandoned, and a blood that they have themselves shed.[1] If I were a partner with them in it then they too have their share of it. But if they did it without me they alone have to face the consequences. Their biggest argument (against me) is (really) against themselves. They are suckling from a mother who is already dry, and bringing into life innovation that is already dead. How disappointing is this challenger (to battle)? Who is this challenger and for what is he being responded to? I am happy that the reasoning of Allah has been exhausted before them and He knows (all) about them."

In fact there was not a shred of evidence ever presented against the Imam, although these lies and innuendo's were used to justify the actions of those whose true goal was the destruction of Islam and returning to the days of ignorance.

Even if you insist that Imam Ali(A.S.) was not nominated as the successor, did he not at least have the right to participate in the selection of the prophets successor? Why did the companions not wait until the washing of the prophets body to nominate his successor? If the issue was that important that it could not wait, would the Prophet of Allah (S.W.A.) forget to address this issue?

Salam