Fundamentals of organzed religion

Bismillah irrahman irrahim

Hi angela, Hope you dont mind but this is not a section for discussion on different belief systems. It is for non-muslims who want to know some thing of islam. If you want to take part in this discussion and S666 dont mind then we can move the thread in interfaith section.

Wassalam

Bismillah irrahman irrahim

Assalamu alaikum

Hi S666, I dont think any1 minds a question when questioner is observing good manners and to learn about some thing, obviously you need to question, so no worries. When i see bit rudeness from you i will tell you and i am sure it wont come to that.

Now going back to the topic, Hope you dont take it as offense but i think you need to polish your history regarding muslims . The first military convoy to subcontinent was sent in command of Muhammad bin Qasim and it was in reply to a letter of a prisoned girl. Your question about why preachers were not sent instead of armies, then yes preachers were sent in many cases who were brutaly killed. Interesting enough mojority of them were sent on request of those people who betrayed the trust of muslims later on by killing those preachers.

Now just want to mention this as well that where ever muslims went, that part of the world got enriched with best technology, education and cultural stuff there was at time. Every body recognises that science and technology came to west through muslims. Muslims made sure that they provide best for all regardless of their religion. Now compare this to what happened when a non-muslim took over the country. First thing they do is kill the governing people, second thing is kill the intellectuals and their facilities. I am not sure whether you come across the article or not but there was this two page story on how america in this day and age made sure that every intellectual in Iraq ends exactly like its first generation when tatars invaded this land.

About your views on counseling the killers and not punishing them, only one thing read more about serial killers or read the stories of people whose loved ones are taken away. I am sure you will come to realize the reality.

I think we already had long and hard discussions about the fact that if Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala knew this person is going to disobey why He created him, why the test when He is all-knowing. There are ninety nine names of Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala that us common beings know of. They are the attributes of our dear Lord, Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala is best in all those without the other getting effected. Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala is All Knowing but at same time He is Most Just Judge. A Just ruler can not punish the person without the crime even though through His complete knowledge He is aware that this person is going to commit the crime. Before creation of Human beings, devil was one of very obedient slave but with reason of gaining power in earth not solely for pleasure of Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala. Creation of Humans made obvious and apparent what the devil was hiding.

Now about only creating the obedient slaves to save the disobedient from the misery. Well if only good ones were let to live then every one who was on earth would have known their end. There was no point of earthly life, how would humans know the bounties and Mercy of our Lord. If there was no worldy life then paradise is no reward and all this would not make much sense and have not much purpose and Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala does not create any thing without a purpose.

Now why so many messengers, well He sent messengers alaihimus salaam to each nation so no one can have an excuse of message not reaching to him. Now how these messages get corrupted is  work of shaytan. He asked permission to lure humans to wrongdoing and permission was granted. Successive messengers is also a piece of test puzzle, it is hard for self to give up some thing dear even though it might have gone old and not quite usefull so Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala wants to see our reaction and wants us to act for His sake alone. But major part of successive messenger is not a test but His mercy, as out of His complete wisdom He allowed devil to do his dirty work for some time, Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala made sure that right and pure message reaches to human through new messengers alaihimus salaam.

You mentioned in one of your previous posts that how we have limited understanding as we are humans and cannot completely comprehend the works of our Lord. So this question of why test? could be only answered to the extent of our intelect and understanding and thats best of my understanding and I can not go beyond that. This brings me to your first question that how do i know about the existance of a supereme being. This is how, I see the vastness of my surrounding, could comprehend some of the wisdom but most is a question so my limitation but the limitless bounties tell me that there is a limitless Creator who created things i can not even think and understand about. And yes you said it absolutely right every thing is easy for creator of all because all He has to say is 'be' and 'it is'. But out of His Mercy, He makes things easy for humans to understand.

Lastly to your first question, first a clarification of a misunderstanding, Holy Quran was not compiled hundered years after Sayyidina Muhammad sallallahu alaihe wassalam went to his Lord. In his life time, he had told the formal writers of Holy Quran about which part goes where and it was on pieces in writing but was not in the form of a book. Now in the time of first caliph abubakr (ra), within the two years of departure of Sayyidina Muhammad sallallahu alaihe wassalam, Holy Quran was compiled in the form of a Book. Even if it was not, there were hundered and hundered of companions who memorized all of the Holy Quran, there were also many who memorised parts. So even the stingiest critics can not say much about the authenticity and compilation of Holy Quran because there is so much continuity that even a difference of a fatah or qasrah is noticed. Even today there are places where kids never get to see a writen copy but learn Holy Quran through their teachers. Now very regularly in muslim world there are competitions held for best recitations and most of people participating learn Holy Quran by heart and no one has ever noticed a difference in another. I have CDs of reciters from across the world and never noticed any thing different.

This accuracy in preserving the book and then the advancement in science has made me certain in the authenticity of Holy Quran. When i am certain that Holy Quran is a divine book then i also get certain that I have One Lord, Allah subhanahu wa ta'ala, that he sent different messengers in different times and last of them was Sayyidina Muhammad sallallahu alaihe wassalam and that prime messenger between him and his Lord was Gibrail alaihis salaam.

Wassalam