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Are Muslim circumcised?

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BMZ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2006 at 11:02am

Annie,

All I know is that Jesus was circumcised according to that Eternal Covenant. He was circumcised to keep him within that Eternal Covenant between God and Abraham, irrespective of Isma'eel or Issac.

Mary and her people knew that Jesus had to be circumcised for she did not want Jesus to come under this clause: "The uncircumcised male whose foreskin has not been circumcised, shall have his soul cut off from his people; he has broken My covenant.' Genesis 17:12-14"

It is no good reason to say that the Gentiles were excluded. The Law did not mention the Gentiles were excluded. It is simple. Jesus was circumcised so all his followers must get circumcised or have their souls cut off from Jesus!  All those who taught the Gentiles, had their foreskins chopped off!  They knew well that the civilised Gentiles would not want to get such a horrible cut and were scared.

So, in order to win them, The Eternal Covenant was damned, discarded and thrown away. Thus Circumcision became an Apocrypha!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Suleyman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2006 at 11:06am
All i remember on the issue is i was running and the doctor was following behind,after the pain i wanted to forget what i had...u should search on the issue and please leave the issue away from me,it is like a Vietnam syndrome,when i see a sharp metal i remember the doctor....

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2006 at 11:18am

Andalus,

From you: "Circumcision was practiced before the Torah was revealed."

You are absolutely right. Torah was not even there then.

"Ishmael was the first born. It is absurd that Abraham would wait until the second born to have his child circumcised, and then not do it to the eldest son."

Issac was born more than a year later after Abraham circumcised himself at 99 and his son Isma'eel at 13. Issac must have been circumcised but not necessarily on the eighth day, as this instruction was given only to Moses. We cannot run Abraham on Mosaic Laws.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2006 at 11:24am

Suleyman,

   

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Suleyman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2006 at 11:32am

BMZSP,too late friend too late.......

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 June 2006 at 11:53am
 That's horrible. I did not emulate Abraham in the age of circumcision!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AnnieTwo Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 June 2006 at 5:50am
Andalus,

Sure there is Annie. The idea of a perfect "man sacrifice" is steeped in pagan belief. The idea of trinity is influenced by pagan belief. The whole idea that one is really not one but a compound one shown by manipulation of Hebrew grammer and volumes of never ending thesises is a huge evidence that the church fathers were uneasy about their own beliefs.

In the Old Testament you will find passages where one person sacrificed himself for others and atoned for sins.

The trinity is supported by Biblical Scriptures.  What I mean by that is that there is only one God and that this one God works through His Word/mouth and creates and that this one God also uses His Holy Spirit.  Jesus in fact made the Holy Spirit's role quite clear in the Gospel of John.

If you follow the teachings of Jesus according to the gospels, then perhaps you might help me to overcome my doubts by going through the points I have put up concerning prophecies in the NT.

I'll have to go take a peek at what you are questioning.

Annie


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14If you are reproached for the name of Christ, blessed are you, for the Spirit of glory and of God rests upon you. On their part He is blasphemed, but on your part He is glorified. 1 Peter 4

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Andalus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 June 2006 at 9:04pm
Originally posted by AnnieTwo AnnieTwo wrote:

Andalus,

Sure there is Annie. The idea of a perfect "man sacrifice" is steeped in pagan belief. The idea of trinity is influenced by pagan belief. The whole idea that one is really not one but a compound one shown by manipulation of Hebrew grammer and volumes of never ending thesises is a huge evidence that the church fathers were uneasy about their own beliefs.

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In the Old Testament you will find passages where one person sacrificed himself for others and atoned for sins.

Greetings Annie!

I have not found an example in the Hebrew Scriptures that tells us that a human can die for the sins of the nation. One will find this idea, which is derived from Greek thought, during the Maccabean revolt in the book of Maccabees. The example found is far from the notion of "vicarious" atonement.

 

Originally posted by Annie2 Annie2 wrote:

The trinity is supported by Biblical Scriptures.  What I mean by that is that there is only one God and that this one God works through His Word/mouth and creates and that this one God also uses His Holy Spirit.  Jesus in fact made the Holy Spirit's role quite clear in the Gospel of John.

Not quite Annie. The Hebrew Scriptures can have the grammer twisted to show that a "compound plural" Gd might exist. The problem is that there is nothing to tell a believer as to how many are in the compound unity. This is not explained until the third century when various groups, each exclaiming their authentic view of Jesus, codified, and cannonized their claim of three. So the problem is that even with all of the twisted interpretations of the Hebrew Grammer in the Hebrew Scriptures, it still does not give you the trintiy that is a major tenent of your faith. You only have a mixed up notion of a "compound unity" of a Gd, not two or three of four, much less Jesus nad the Holy Spirit. 

 

Originally posted by Annie2 Annie2 wrote:

  

If you follow the teachings of Jesus according to the gospels, then perhaps you might help me to overcome my doubts by going through the points I have put up concerning prophecies in the NT.

I'll have to go take a peek at what you are questioning.

Annie

Thanks!

A feeling of discouragement when you slip up is a sure sign that you put your faith in deeds. -Ibn 'Ata'llah
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