The Original Sin

The Saint wrote: Greetings The Saint, On the one hand you are saying that God can not be limited, and in the next breath you are saying God is 'indivisible, One only One', but going on to say 'we are not aware of all His dimensions because He does not reveal all of them'. So where is the problem with the Trinity concept of God? Knowing the Trinity does not mean there are not other aspects of God that we do not know, or that are not revealed. These three are what have been revealed. Revealed where?

The Word of Yshwe Himself (recorded in the book of Matthew, chapter 28)

¹⁹ Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

caringheart wrote: I feel as though my muslim brothers and sisters struggle with the concept of the Trinity because they do not understand it.

But Muslims are not alone in this trouble, my brother! Why you make them exception when your own churches weren't on the same page till many centuries later. Even now the debate over Mariam doctrine is not fully Canonized. Please no offense intended, this is what I think is one of the left over evolutionary doctrines of Christianity, where some have been settled and some new ones are in process of making.

They do not know Christianity, and they do not know the words that Yshwe spoke... they do not know what He taught to His Disciples, and what has been passed on by those very Disciples.

Again, why blame Muslims when by your own confession there is an error of +/- 100 years of Biblical scriptural authenticity. Of course you have the Holy Ghost for your time to time guidance. But the question remains, why this Holy Ghost didn't work right from the day one to record each and every word of Jesus and not let it slip into the anonymous authorship of 'Mathew' or other 3 so called 'Canonical' gospel accounts?

I like your comment

Thanks.

Caringheart wrote: AhmadJoyia wrote: caringheart wrote: I feel as though my muslim brothers and sisters struggle with the concept of the Trinity because they do not understand it. But Muslims are not alone in this trouble, my brother! Why you make them exception when your own churches weren't on the same page till many centuries later. Even now the debate over Mariam doctrine is not fully Canonized. Please no offense intended, this is what I think is one of the left over evolutionary doctrines of Christianity, where some have been settled and some new ones are in process of making. Greetings AhmadJoyia,Again, I think you do not understand. The early disciples were trying to sort all the things which Yshwe had said to them. They were trying to understand the fullness of the revelation. The council of Nicea was to bring all the Disciples of Christ together to make a final conclusion about the nature of Christ.

You are talking of about 3 to 4 centuries later. Do you think you can call them �Early disciples? Secondly, which �Disciples of Christ� are you referring here? John, Mathew, Luke, or Mark or any others like����???? Thirdly, even I take your answer, would it not confirm your own amazement about Muslims; that where it took more than 400 years for the Christian Church to understand �nature of Jesus�, how would it be possible for an ordinary person of Max age 80-90 years, be able to understand this concept so quickly within his life time? That is what is called impossibility for an human intellect.

Caringheart wrote: Among the 300 that gathered for discussion, the Triune nature of God, the Father; Christ, the Son; and the Holy Spirit; was decided by a consensus of 297. Pretty compelling if you ask me.From my earlier studies, I share with you: 300 bishops gathered at Nicea, there were 17 dissenters at first, and in the end only 3 dissenters to the interpretation of the scripture. (Keep in mind the council was not about deciding scripture, but only the interpretation of the scriptures. The scriptures were already set.) The scriptures were written long before the council of Nicea ever convened. The decision at that council came out of those scriptures, not the other way around.

My brother, no offense intended, I simply ask you to be honest with yourself. I have full regard to your beliefs but please don�t share which you yourself think is not the whole truth about the canonization of bible. Not the council of Nicea, but I hope you would agree with this website which describe the canonization process.

Caringheart wrote: AhmadJoyia wrote: Caringheart wrote: They do not know Christianity, and they do not know the words that Yshwe spoke... they do not know what He taught to His Disciples, and what has been passed on by those very Disciples. Again, why blame Muslims when by your own confession there is an error of +/- 100 years of Biblical scriptural authenticity. Please do not speak libel against me. I confess no such thing.

But then confront me. Don�t just walk away as you did from the other topic where this was being discussed. Even now in your allusion of �early disciples� is only accurate to +/- 300 years; isn�t it?

Caringheart wrote: AhmadJoyia wrote: Of course you have the Holy Ghost for your time to time guidance. But the question remains, why this Holy Ghost didn't work right from the day one to record each and every word of Jesus and not let it slip into the anonymous authorship of 'Mathew' or other 3 so called 'Canonical' gospel accounts? Why was the qur'an kept only by oral tradition, until it was later written down? Was was the qur'an 'let slip into the anonymous authorship put together by Uthman'?It was the practice of the times. Writing was not a thing of the common man.asalaam and blessings to you, Caringheart

Your answer is simply a diverter to my question, a kind of tactic to avert an apparently harsh question, even though through wrong understanding of Quran history. Quran was fully available in written form but only in fragmented form during the life time of the Prophet. It was first compiled in the book form during the reign of 1st Caliph Hazrat Abu Bakr.


Edited by AhmadJoyia - 31 January 2016 at 12:12pm