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Edited by Muslim75 - 02 January 2015 at 11:29am

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Edited by Muslim75 - 02 January 2015 at 11:29am

kingskid wrote: Greetings Hasan and may peace be yours.I hear what you are saying.� You have done a lot of research and find that there are those who agree with you on a presumed fallacy of Biblical scriptures.� They are out there, of course.� But you see, Hasan, I could do the same thing and tell you what Don Richardson, Ibn. Warraq, Bat Ye'or, Reza Safa, David Pryce-Jones, et al, say about Islam and the fallacies thereof.� But, those arguments just lead to a door swinging both ways.� You obviously are a pursuer of truth, as am I.� However, it takes more than just making your pursuit hinge on four points that are important to you.� That's approaching the issue from a very subjective stance.� An� objective approach may be more beneficial.� You say you believe the Gospel (I assume you mean Mat., Mark, Luke and John) was sent from God but people changed it along with the other books you mentioned.� If that is the case, then all Biblical references in the Quran should be deleted.� Once any part of something becomes suspect for one reason or another, then the whole thing becomes suspect.To the extent that I am able, I hear your heart and the deep desire you have for things of God.� However, Muslims are not the only people who seek God.� My heart beats for God and I love Him with everything I have, imperfectly for sure, but so passionately that I feel consumed by His presence at times.� My Bible teaches me that it was Yeshua, the Son of God Who clothed Himself in humanity in order to do for me what no man can do for himself: to die for my sins.� He then rose from the dead and now sits at the right hand of God.� The Bible also says that we love God because He first loved us.� And there is no more powerful demonstration of His love for mankind than what was done at Calvary.� John 3:16 can be meditated on from now to eternity and we'll never be able to comprehend what it cost Yeshua in both His humanity and divinity to willingly lay down His life for sinful man.� That kind of love so surpasses anything I have ever experienced, and it absolutely slays me.Hasan, I encourage you to not feel anguish or anger towards those who do not share your faith.� We do not need others to agree with us, but to try to hear each other's heart, because deep down, we are all created in the image of God and are on a pilgrimage to know Him better.� We take different roads in approaching God and He will sort it all out in due time.� God bless and peace to you, my fellow traveler.

Kingskid,
in my search there is nothing "presumed fallacy of Biblical scripture" as you put it. It is all about truthful and logical examination of facts and nothing presumed.

I agree that there are more than four points to examine, but what am talking about are the most fundamental points that not only cover the bulk of any faith but also they are the main points we differ upon.

I never claim that only Muslim's heart beats for God. To the contrary there might be many Muslims by claim who engage in activities not approved of God. Neither I say that anyone owns God, instead God owns us all. It is only the ways each one of us seek Him that might be different. Since human mind is very independent and innovative when it comes to God and can go way off, God has described Himself through His own word. A Muslim thus does not add anything from his/herself about God.

Whatever clothes you put on Jesus, there is nothing that can change reality and truth, he was a man, a beloved prophet of God. He has a God, to whom he worshiped, cried to for help and returned to. To whom he called father as well as God (according to the Bible). I don't argue that his message was love and truth, does that make him God, no. Like I said, there is no claim by Jesus that he was God, even it was there, it could not be the truth. God is unique, he does not take form of his own creation like you think or like Hindus think that God came in the form of a monkey or an elephant on earth and they make statues of them and worship them, much like many Christians make statues of a blonde man (as if God is blonde with blue eyes) and worship it. It is the same, worshiping the created and idol worship.

I don't know your name, but dear friend, I never feel anguish toward people of any faith as you said I do. However, if any comes and preach to me, they better be prepared as I am very open minded but straight forward, and don't accept anything but provable truth and no fairy tales and unexplained traditions.
To each one of us it is our own journey, what you come to believe, think and do will only affect you, and that is a point of relief for a believer like myself. You will not be in my grave, nor I will be in yours. You will not answer for me, nor will I answer for you. You will reap what you did, I will what I did. This is the time to know and accept the truth or reject it. The next stage will be Accountability, followed by eternal life according to your "book of life". Oh, each stage is irreversible, you cannot go back to fix it when you the the reality of what you did. So it is now or never.
May God Almighty guide, forgive and bless all who seek Him, Ameen.
Hasan

Edited by honeto - 30 November 2014 at 2:38pm

Greetings Hasan,

I am not disrespecting muslims and islam just because I have different information and beliefs.
If we used your reasoning then muslims have disrespected Christians and Christianity just as much, by their denial of the things Yshwe came and did... by saying that He did not give His life, after all the suffering that He went through for our sakes... What could be more disrespectiful?

29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

Perhaps I should share the rest of what the person I quoted, had to say;

We apologize to anyone who may be offended by the history of the founder of Islam (Muhammad).  And we are aware of the sensitivities involved.  However, infinitely more damage has been done to Islam's "believers" by Islam's history of withholding the truth about its founder to them -- - and the circumstances surrounding its inception --  than any "damage" this true history can cause.

asalaam and blessings,
Caringheart


Edited by Caringheart - 30 November 2014 at 4:02pm