Tolerance

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 Natassia wrote:

@ honeto/Hasan
after reading you and your silly arguments it is obvious that you don;t have any serious intention to learn rather force your opinion upon others, and get upset when they don't believe you. That's pittyful and a shame, but you choose what you do, you are going to reap it. (No logical bearing on this discussion.)
There is a term in geology that says " present is the key to the past" (We're not talking about rocks.)
You don't need to know what happened in the past if all you are going to do is to deny it. So like a geologist, we will apply this and see what has been going on in our times in terms of spreading of Islam. You and I live in today's world, so you can believe as an eye witness that what is going on is true. (I also see an incredibly high number of violent acts being perpetrated by Islamists. Should I just show them a blind eye?)
Despite a global effort to control the spread of Islam (in our eye witnessed history), Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world. (There has not been a global effort to control the spread of Islam. There was a global effort for quite some time to control the spread of communism...but Islam? No.) This fact use to circulate around the globe just ten years ago very openly after the publishing of the century report by the Catholic church. This report showed Islam as the fastest growing religion by a big margin, in double digit percentage numbers in 20th century. (Do you think ex-Muslims in Saudi Arabia or Iran report their conversion to other faiths or atheism?)
Unlike Christian conversions of low cast Hindus and of the poor and the orphens in India, poor and orphens of Africa and other poor countries which still turned out to be only in fractions, the coversions to Islam was not by exploiting the disadvantaged or the poor, but by people from all walks of life and mostly in the Western hamisphere where people have more, education, wealth and freedom. (Exactly my point. You can't truly practice Islamic law in the West, so the religious aspect of Islam appeals to people...whereas most Westerners are downright ignorant about shariah law and are probably quite uninformed regarding the more detailed writings of the Hadith and Tafsirs.)
No swords, no armies, no forcing, no compulsion and no proof of such fake cries and lies, just plain truth. (Uh huh. Just ignore all those persecution reports.) And like I said that is despite the full scale efforts to oppose this spread through all hidden and open methods by those who are going to end up as loosers one day anyway, as they not only deny the truth of submission to their Creator, but on top mislead others. And as expected, their punishment will pile up to be rightly most severe for what they do. (Typical Islamic propoganda.)
May God guide you to the right and the truth, seek His guidence in this month of blessings. Seek His forgiveness and mercy by speaking and spreading only the truth. (You really think God isn't guiding me? Or perhaps it is your Allah who misguides me. Did you ever consider that?) 

Natassia,
you remind me of "believer and Robin" who use to do your job on this forum, they are kind of disappeared as you appeared??
Are you incarn .... ..anyway let us continue:

I will address in order to what you commented:
1- right, no logical bearing on this discussion, when you simply deny facts shown to you. Further your jumping from issue to issue with endless arguments and draging show your real intentions, which I don't need to reveal, its too obvious.

2- right, we are not talking about rocks, but since you and I live in today's world and if you see leaves of a plant green, logic and science help us assume that they were green five hundered years or a thousand years ago too. Even though there is no doubt that the leaves were green then you cannot claim to have witnessed them. But today with your own eyes you see them green and can testify as such. So if you see that there is no sword, no army, no money, no ignorence and no compulsion that is making people to turn to Islam, what I am saying is that you, I and our time is a witness to this fact and if people like you who do not believe the past, the one they did not witness, you have the present as a eye witnessed truth. Will you deny what you and your time sees?

3-You just don't get it, do you? how old are you? or do you not live in this world. First you know that violent acts are committed by people, if you need more than that I will be glad to give you a world history 101 class.
Second I will give a number here, this will give an idea of the truth and real numbers, also its a challenge: Just between 1990 and 1994 more than 2 millions Muslims were killed by Christian armies. In last ten years more than 2 million more. You fill in the gaps of time to figure out the rest. There is no comparison to what you are trying to portray as somethng major. And anything unjust whether be killing or act is un-Islamic in the first place, thus you cannot blame Islam, its the act of people. Just like killings and violent acts committed by those who happen to be Christians don't represent their religion.

4- Again, I would say you are a)out of touch with reality b)deny the facts c)yourself part of that anti-Islamic crusade.
Live and see a day from the eyes fo a Muslim here in the West, and you will know the truth.

5- that is purely a political question, it is wrong to think that those countries practice Islam. The are Muslim countries, but their laws may not be completely in accordance to Islamic teachings. For example, Saudi Arabia has kings and princes who enjoy a luxurious lifestyles generations after generations, that is un-Islamic. Under a true Islamic society all will have protection of law.

5- I see the conversted Western commit to practicing and following more aspects of Islam than those born into it. Does that tell you something?

6 " Uh huh" I don't know what are you talking about, all the converted people I personally met did not face anyone of those things: sword, army, compulsion etc.

7- If you mean your Creator and my Creator, then we are talking of the same. God only guides, its some of us that humble ourself and answer that call, and some of us ignore or reject that call. 

Because I believe and care for my life that comes after this one, I acknowledge my Creator and I answer to His call for my own good. And I seek His forgiveness as I make mistakes too.

Hasan

Edited by honeto - 26 August 2009 at 4:59pm