IslamiCity.org Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Religion - Islam > Islam for non-Muslims
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Abrogation?  What is Islam What is Islam  Donate Donate
  FAQ FAQ  Quran Search Quran Search  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Abrogation?
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 7891011 15>
Author
Message
  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
believer View Drop Down
Guest Group
Guest Group


Joined: 08 January 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 1397 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote believer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 August 2008 at 6:38am
Chapter 2 was the 87th revealed before chapter 3 the 89th, so chapter 3 is the better one according to Islam.  This explains why so many christians are called losers by Muslims. 
 
002.062
YUSUFALI: Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
PICKTHAL: Lo! Those who believe (in that which is revealed unto thee, Muhammad), and those who are Jews, and Christians, and Sabaeans - whoever believeth in Allah and the Last Day and doeth right - surely their reward is with their Lord, and there shall no fear come upon them neither shall they grieve.
SHAKIR: Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the f Christians, and the Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve.
 
003.085
YUSUFALI: If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah), never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter He will be in the ranks of those who have lost (All spiritual good).
PICKTHAL: And whoso seeketh as religion other than the Surrender (to Allah) it will not be accepted from him, and he will be a loser in the Hereafter.
SHAKIR: And whoever desires a religion other than Islam, it shall not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he shall be one of the losers.


Edited by believer - 28 August 2008 at 6:42am
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Back to Top
minuteman View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 25 March 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 1642 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote minuteman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 August 2008 at 11:53pm
 
 believer, please explain clearly what you want to say. You have something in mind. Bring it out please. Thanks. There is no enmity against any one in Quran except the hostile disbelievers and attackers (Kaafirs).
 
 Peaceful Jews and christians, doing good deeds have nothing to fear. They submit to their God in their own way and perform their religious rites AND DO GOOD DEEDS. They will not be harmed at all. It is the duty of all Muslims to protect the sacred places, synagogues, temples of all religions.


Edited by minuteman - 28 August 2008 at 11:59pm
Back to Top
halfalife View Drop Down
Starter
Starter
Avatar

Joined: 18 August 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 14 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote halfalife Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 August 2008 at 8:03am

owww, i think this thread has ended. Star

Let us start a new thread about the tradition of travelin, which is the tradition of most if not all prophets and messengers of The Almighty, The Owner, and the reality on the ground (and above) with respect to those who claim to follow the way of the prophets....what i m trying to say is, "move on!".


Edited by halfalife - 29 August 2008 at 8:08am
Back to Top
Ron Webb View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar
Male atheist
Joined: 30 January 2008
Location: Ottawa, Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 2467 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Webb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 August 2008 at 7:55pm
Originally posted by minuteman minuteman wrote:

Peaceful Jews and christians, doing good deeds have nothing to fear. They submit to their God in their own way and perform their religious rites AND DO GOOD DEEDS. They will not be harmed at all.
According to 2:62; but 3:85 clearly says otherwise.  The central tenet of Christianity is the divinity of Christ.  It is very definitely "a religion other than Islam".  There is no getting around the contradiction here.  Either it is explained by abrogation or it cannot be explained at all.
Addeenul �Aql � Religion is intellect.
Back to Top
believer View Drop Down
Guest Group
Guest Group


Joined: 08 January 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 1397 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote believer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2008 at 1:58pm
 
What was happening to Mohammad when this verse was recorded?
 
002.062
YUSUFALI: Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
PICKTHAL: Lo! Those who believe (in that which is revealed unto thee, Muhammad), and those who are Jews, and Christians, and Sabaeans - whoever believeth in Allah and the Last Day and doeth right - surely their reward is with their Lord, and there shall no fear come upon them neither shall they grieve.
SHAKIR: Surely those who believe, and those who are Jews, and the f Christians, and the Sabians, whoever believes in Allah and the Last day and does good, they shall have their reward from their Lord, and there is no fear for them, nor shall they grieve.
 
What was happening to Mohammad when this verse was recorded?
003.085
YUSUFALI: If anyone desires a religion other than Islam (submission to Allah), never will it be accepted of him; and in the Hereafter He will be in the ranks of those who have lost (All spiritual good).
PICKTHAL: And whoso seeketh as religion other than the Surrender (to Allah) it will not be accepted from him, and he will be a loser in the Hereafter.
SHAKIR: And whoever desires a religion other than Islam, it shall not be accepted from him, and in the hereafter he shall be one of the losers.
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Back to Top
believer View Drop Down
Guest Group
Guest Group


Joined: 08 January 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 1397 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote believer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 August 2008 at 2:24pm
What I am trying to get aat is what is the context? 
 
When you read and study the Bible you always have to keep in mind the context.
 
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Back to Top
minuteman View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member

Joined: 25 March 2007
Status: Offline
Points: 1642 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote minuteman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 August 2008 at 12:04am
Originally posted by Ron Webb Ron Webb wrote:

Originally posted by minuteman minuteman wrote:

Peaceful Jews and christians, doing good deeds have nothing to fear. They submit to their God in their own way and perform their religious rites AND DO GOOD DEEDS. They will not be harmed at all.
 
According to 2:62; but 3:85 clearly says otherwise.  The central tenet of Christianity is the divinity of Christ.  It is very definitely "a religion other than Islam".  There is no getting around the contradiction here.  Either it is explained by abrogation or it cannot be explained at all.
 
 Ron, even if the central context of christianity is the divinity of Jesus, it was very well known to the prophet and the Muslims and it was being mentioned (argued) in the Quran.

Despite that, the christians were given the status of the people of the book. Despite that it is being told to them that if they believe in God and hereafter and do good deeds, they have nothing to fear for anything of the past or future. That is verse 2:62.

That is a very peaceful way of life that is called Islam. That is one important aspect of Islam. Remember that Muslims are included in that verse of general peaceful behaviour. Similarly there are some other important aspects of Islam such as NO COMPULSION.

The verse 3:85 stands on its own. It tells that any one who will bring a religion other than Islam, it will not be accepted. It will not flourish. The real religion with Allah is Islam. No other religion will He accept. Also remember that the religion of all the prophets of Allah was Islam. But the people distorted that and made changes in their revealed religion.

That is the most important argument from me for you now (and for believer) that the religion revealed to all prophets from Allah had been Islam. They all preached Islam. So Allah will not accept any religion other than Islam. But christians however with their misguided theology, if they do good deeds and remain peaceful, will have no fear....

 There is no contradiction or mistake..... or msimatch between verse 3:85 and verse 2:62.



Edited by minuteman - 31 August 2008 at 12:06am
Back to Top
believer View Drop Down
Guest Group
Guest Group


Joined: 08 January 2008
Status: Offline
Points: 1397 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote believer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 August 2008 at 6:48am
No the  central context of christianity is the sacrifice of Jesus, a gift given to us from GOD.
John 3
16"For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 7891011 15>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 12.03
Copyright ©2001-2019 Web Wiz Ltd.