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Surah 19:19, Adam and Isa

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DeExupery View Drop Down
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    Posted: 14 January 2006 at 5:52am

It is interesting that Quran only mention ONE Prophet to be sinless, namely Isa.

So there are only two prophets mentioned in Quran which are sinless:

1) Prophet Adam (before fell into sin)

2) Prophet Isa (Surah 19:19).

Do you have any idea why? I would love to discuss about this.

 

Fox

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Rahmat Ali View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rahmat Ali Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 January 2006 at 6:13pm
Dear DeExupery,

tnx for the questions:
you wrote:
quote:
� It is interesting that Quran only mention ONE Prophet to be sinless, namely Isa.
So there are only two prophets mentioned in Quran which are sinless:
1) Prophet Adam (before fell into sin)
2) Prophet Isa (Surah 19:19).
Do you have any idea why? I would love to discuss about this. �

Fox
--------------------------------------

It is not true. Not only Prophet Adam and Prophet Jesus, but all of them were sinless.
And in case of Adam, it was not a sin, but a mistake. We read in the Book of God Allaah the following verses:
Taken from English translation and commentary of Muhammad Ali:

Chapter 20: Ta-Ha
20:121. � So they both ate of it, then their evil inclinations became manifest to them, and they began to cover themselves with the leaves of the garden. And Adam disobeyed his Lord, and was disappointed.�
20:122. � Then his Lord chose him, so He turned to him and guided (him).�

Or Muhammad Asad`s translation: � Thereafter, [however,) his Sustainer elected him [for His grace], and accepted his repentance, and bestowed His guidance upon him.�

You see, it is the same meaning.
Then some relevant verses.

Chapter 2: Al-Baqarah
2:36: � But the devil made them slip from it,a and caused them to depart from the state in which they were. And We said: Go forth,b some of you are the enemies of others. And there is for you in the earth an abode and a provision for a time.c �

36a. Azalla (translated as made them slip) is derived from zall, to slip (foot or tongue) unintentionally (R), and zallat is a fault committed unintentionally (R). Azalla-huma therefore means the devil made them commit a fault unintentionally. The result was that they were made to depart from the happy condition in which they were. The lesson taught here is that real happiness lies in peace of mind, so that when the peace of mind is disturbed by committing an evil, even if it be unintentional, physical happiness does not avail a man.

How did the devil do it? Here the Quran again contradicts the Bible. It was not the serpent that misled Eve, nor did Eve mislead Adam. The devil cast an evil suggestion into the minds of both Adam and Eve, as he casts evil suggestions into the mind of every son and daughter of Adam and Eve: "But the devil made an evil suggestion to them that he might make manifest to them that which had been hidden from them of their shame" (7:20).

36b. Habt sometimes means going down a declivity, or descending from a high place to a low one, but its more frequent use in literature is simply in the sense of removing from one place to another, as in ihbitu misr-an (2:61), which means go to, or enter into, a city. It also signifies simply change in condition. According to LL, habata means he came forth from it and also he became lowered or degraded. And habt further signifies falling into evil; or becoming low or abject; or suffering loss or diminution. This loss or suffering is brought about by means of indulgence in evil.
The new condition in which man finds himself by submitting to his low desires is the condition of the mutual enmity of one to the other, the tyranny of man to man being undoubtedly the greatest evil which man can commit. The use of the words "some of you are the enemies of others" shows clearly that this address is not to Adam and Eve alone, but to all mankind or man in general.

36c. The words "an abode and a provision for a time" refer to man�s span of life on earth, which is limited as compared with the eternal life of the next world.
It was pure the forgetfulness of Adam, that`s the reason of his disobeying.

2:37: � Then Adam received (revealed) words from his Lord, and He turned to him (mercifully).a Surely He is Oft-returning (to mercy), the Merciful.�

37a. The Arabic word taubah (repentance) gives us in fact the philosophy of repentance. Taba originally means he returned, and hence the primary meaning of taba il-Allahi is he returned to Allah. In religious terminology the word taubah comes to mean the returning to a state of obedience. Thus taubah implies a perfect change in the course of one�s life, and this is repentance according to the Holy Quran. It is not an utterance of certain words, but an actual change for the better. The same word taba is used to express the Divine act of the acceptance of repentance, with reference again to the original meaning of the word, because in this case the Divine Being deals with man mercifully.

Kalimat (words) here means the revealed words of God. Man is found too weak to overcome the evil suggestions of the devil or the evil inclinations in him, however strong he may be to conquer the forces of nature. So God comes to his help and reveals Himself to him. He sends down revelation which, strengthening his faith in God, gives him the strength to overcome the devil and reject his suggestions.

20:115. � And certainly We gave a commandment to Adam before, but he forgot; and We found in him no resolve (to disobey). �

This shows that Adam`s fault was not intentional, and hence no sin can be attributed to him on this ground.

Al-Imran (The Family of Imran) 3:161:
� And it is not attributable to a prophet that he should act unfaithfully.�

Al-Anbiya (The Prophets) 21:26-27:
� And [yet,] some say, � The Most Gracious has taken unto Himself a son�! Limitless is He in His glory! Nay, [those whom they regard as God�s �offspring� are but His] honoured servants:they speak not until He has spoken unto them, and [whenever they act,] they act at His behest. �

or

� And they say: The Benificent God has taken to Himself a son; glory be to Him ! Nay ! They are honoured servants. they do not precede Him in speech and (only) according to His commandment do they act.�
The meaning is that they whom they call sons are honoured servants of Allaah.

Al-Mu'minun (The Believers) 23:51-52:
� O you Apostles! Partake of the good things of life, and do righteous deeds: verily, I have full knowledge of all that you do. And, verily, this community of yours is one single community, since I am the Sustainer of you all: remain, then, conscious of Me ! �

The community of all Prophets is one single community. They are sinless.

Salaam ( peace )
Rahmat Ali from Holland

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DeExupery View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DeExupery Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 January 2006 at 8:40am

Dear Rahmat,

You said:

It is not true. Not only Prophet Adam and Prophet Jesus, but all of them were sinless.
And in case of Adam, it was not a sin, but a mistake.

 

What is a sin? What is a mistake? If they (Prophet Adam and Eve) didn't fall into sin, how could God sent him out of Heaven?

We are not yet talking about the repentance. But I think Quran and Bible stress that Prophet Adam and Eva fell into sin.

But before that, Both Books don't mention about Prophet Adam and Eve is sinned.

Actually, you may say that all the prophets are sinless, but I would love you to quote Quranic Source to support your statement, because I have already given you Surah 19:19 about Isa sinless nature.

Being forgiven and being sinless is not the same. Being forgiven means that somene make mistakes (sins) and God forgives and purify. Being sinless means that that someone never makes mistakes.

I think this will be an interesting discussion.

Fox

 

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Shams Zaman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shams Zaman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 January 2006 at 11:00am

Dear Expurcy!

There is difference between sin and mistake. Satan did sin. He refused to bow infront of Adam and then refused to repent. He knew what he was doing and did it in arrogance. What Adam did was a mistake as he repented afterwards and he had no intent to disobey Allah.

If I kill someone while driving it would be a mistake, but with an intent to kill someone if I hit him with a car then it is a sin.

The main thing which differentiate between sin and a mistake is INTENT. Quran says in 20:115. "And certainly We gave a commandment to Adam before, but he forgot; and We did not find in him any determination (for sin)".

Shams Zaman

 

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DeExupery Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2006 at 8:12am

Dear Shams Zaman,

Are Djinn angels too before?

Back to the topic. In my opinion, sin is DISOBEDIENCE to God's laws. Like in Quran, when God tells you to do A and you do the opossite of A, then you are sinned. And even if you want to differentiate the terms, the SIN/MISTAKE makes God furious and He did cast Prophet Adam and Eve from HIS PRESENCE.

Do you agree with that?

Fox

By the way, your version doesn't say so that ADAM was not sinned. Can you give me the version which shows that it is not sinned if doing anything against God's law if we don't intend to do so, IN QURAN?

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote firewall Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 January 2006 at 9:59am
if it's not a sin, why do Adam seek forgiveness from Allah (God)? only by Allah's acceptance, forgivesness & mercy that sins can be expiated. one should understand how hard all the Prophets seek forgiveness everyday from Allah. how they work harder, trialed harder to earn that. how his deeds are far weightier than us. by far. very very far. and yet the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) prayed until his feet swells, asking forgiveness at least 100 times a day.

& yet, we make more mistakes than them, do less deeds than them. but feels so happy-go-luck about it. as if Allah's forgiveness is promised to us.


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Shams Zaman View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Shams Zaman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 February 2006 at 9:24am

Sorry brother Dexupery for being so late!

I was out of town and could not sit on line.

I would agree to your opinion, "sin is DISOBEDIENCE to God's laws" but you have again missed my point. The intentional disobedience of God's law is a sin, but disobedience without a purposeful desire is a mistake. Like if I don't get up in the morning for prayers its a mistake, now if I use this as a routine excuse then its a sin.

Moreover, I have to seek forgiveness for my mistakes as well. The Quranic verse which I quoted above 20:115, clearly shows that Adam committed a mistake and repented for it and he had no intent to delibralitely break the God's commendments. Rather he was lured in by the satan or the Lucifer.

Secondly, Djins or the Jinns were not angels or vice versa. Jinns are the creation of God from fire while angels are the creation of smokeless light or NOOR. However, Lucifer did enjoy a respectable position among the angels as well due to his piousness. But his positon led him to self-conciet and proudness, thus he was tested by God and was given the order to bow infront of Adam. So he failed the test and insisted on his stand which led him to the most grave nature of sin.

I am not sure that any verse on the version which shows that it is not sinned if doing anything against God's law if we don't intend to do so, IN QURAN? or not however, here are some verses which are somewhat close to the subject:

4:31 "If you avoid the great sins which you are forbidden, We will do away with your small sins and cause you to enter an honorable place of entering."

11:114 "And keep up prayer in the two parts of the day and in the first hours of the night; surely good deeds take away evil deeds this is a reminder to the mindful."

39:53 "Say: O my servants! who have trangressed against their own souls, do not despair of the mercy of Allah; surely Allah forgives the faults altogether; surely He is the Forgiving the Merciful."

So once He forgives it becomes like a clean sheet which has been wiped off from the writings. That is why the one who is a newly convert usually holds a much higher position than a born Muslim. Why? because his all sins are wiped off and he starts his life as a newly born, deviod of all sins.

Shams Zaman    Pakistan.

 

 

 

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muqtadar View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote muqtadar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 December 2006 at 7:25pm
I qoute a Hadith of Prophet to this subject" that all the son of adam acommit mistake or sins but best of them repent"This includes all the prophets exept what quran declares otherwise
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