Discussion on Qu�ran re: Pope, deleted

fogtrik wrote:   The forum moderators have deleted this post once already and members continue to avoid dicussing these three passages. Why? There are ample examples of violent acts found in the Qur�an.  I�ll name just three. First off, us unbeliever�s are not popular, as found in sura 9:5 which says, "But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay those who join other gods with Allah wherever you find them; besiege them, seize them, lay in wait for them with every kind of ambush...".  I really hate how the Qur�an separates its followers from the non believers, why is this needed? Please help me understand this! Sura 47:4 says, "When you encounter the unbelievers, strike off their heads, until ye have made a great slaughter among them...".  Sure, give me grief for taking this out of context, but the last god I meet said he co-workers would say none the such J In sura 5:33 the Qur'an orders those who fight Allah and his messenger to be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off; or they can be expelled out of the land.  If this thread continues, I can find 100 more. Surely if someone talked to god, god would not have so many violent things to say. Discuss? Fogtrik

Salam wa alaikum my dear brothers and sisters.I will be more then happy to clear ANY false claim attributed to the qur'an inshallah.Now fogtrok is doing is posting surah 9:5 without the explaination. Surah 9:5 is not complete without surah 9:6.For ANY war to start in the 1st place the muslims must be attacked first, "Fight in the cause of God those who fight you, but do not transgress limits; for God loveth not transgressors.  (The Noble Quran, 2:190)"


And also for AT any time if the enemy asks for peace the muslims have to give it.

"But if the enemy incline towards peace, do thou (also) incline towards peace, and trust in God: for He is One that heareth and knoweth (all things).  (The Noble Quran, 8:61)"

Now the reason why the qur'an says to fight and slay the unbeleivers is because the unbeleivers are attacking them 1st,there killing innocent people and oppressing the muslims....that is why surah 9:5 says what it says.BUT even still the muslims have to show mercy to there enemys...this is surah 9:6.

       If one amongst the Pagans ask thee for asylum, grant it to him, so that he may hear the word of Allah; and then escort him to where he can be secure. That is because they are men without knowledge.

So you cannot say islam is "Bad" because it is telling the unbeleivers to fight those who are fighting them...all these verses in the quran talking about war  directly MUST come together you cannot just pick 1 out of context...

Sura 47:4 is the same story,the pagans attacked them first so this is what surah 47:4 is telling them to do so they can protect themselves.AT ANY time the pagans could of said PEACE and the muslims would HAVE to give it because god commands it in the qur'an.What is the difference between stabbing a man and cutting a mans head off?It's war and god would rather let you kill your enemy the quick and painless way rather then make him suffer.

FOGTROK is NOT giving you the full story about surah 5:33......surah 5:33 IMO is to LIGHT you know why?

    The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter.

The quran is talking about people who do MISCHEIF.when the qur'an is talking about those people it's talking about the people who start wars and causes LOTS of deaths...would you rather killed 1 bad man or would you rather let thousands die?Also the quran says Those who wage war AND spread mischief.

You will find the Anti-muslims use the same arguments for EVERY debate against muslims.It's actually funny.I could right now prove the bible wrong but I do not want to offend any non-muslims. Here are some verses in the quran that directly speak about how muslims should act in war.

If thou dost stretch thy hand against me, to slay me, it is not for me to stretch my hand against thee to slay thee: for I do fear God, the cherisher of the worlds.  (The Noble Quran, 5:28)"

"God does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you about religion and have not driven you out of your homes. God loves just dealers.  (The Noble Quran, 60:8)"

"And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for God.  But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against wrongdoers.  (The Noble Quran 2:193)"

"Let there be no compulsion in religion:  Truth stands out clear from error:  whoever rejects evil and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trustworthy handhold, that never breaks.  And Allah heareth and knoweth all things.  (The Noble Quran, 2:256)"

"Again and again will those who disbelieve, wish that they had bowed (to God's will) in Islam.   Leave them alone, to enjoy (the good things of this life) and to please themselves: let (false) hope amuse them: soon will knowledge (undeceive them).  (The Noble Quran, 15:2-3)"

"Say, 'The truth is from your Lord': Let him who will believe, and let him who will, reject (it):......(The Noble Quran, 18:29)"

"If it had been thy Lord's will, they would all have believed,- all who are on earth! wilt thou then COMPEL mankind, against their will, to believe!  (The Noble Quran, 10:99)"

"Say: 'Obey Allah, and obey the Messenger: but if ye turn away, he is only responsible for the duty placed on him and ye for that placed on you.   If ye obey him, ye shall be on right guidance.  The Messenger's duty is only to preach the clear (Message).  (The Noble Quran, 24:54)"

"Say : O ye that reject Faith!  I worship not that which ye worship, Nor will ye worship that which I worship.  And I will not worship that which ye have been wont to worship, Nor will ye worship that which I worship.  To you be your Way, and to me mine.  (The Noble Quran, 109:1-6)"

Salam wa alaikum,peace and blessing be upon you all muslim and non muslim inshallah.

Special Thanks to osama abdullah.

This atricle is from :Shadi Ahmad Sayyid.




Edited by Shadi_Al-amin

Fidel - You wrote: "Islam stands for freedom and peace, the rest is propaganda." On what authority do you speak for Islam? You are not Caliph; there IS no Caliph.

Hola! anyone there who could traslate the above for me, please?

And, would anyone with two and a half braincells to rub together also, please, inform me what authority do I need to announce some universal truth like the sun rises from the East?

I am tempted to ask this man: "on what authority do you speak for Life", but I am definitely not going to stoop to any such level of sublime stupidity.

Edited by Whisper