polygomy
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Category: Culture & Community
Forum Name: Groups : Women (Sisters)
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Topic: polygomy
Posted By: pistacchio
Subject: polygomy
Date Posted: 22 June 2009 at 3:59pm
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salam to all my sisters Ive been reading some of your comments on the other posts and you seem to be full of understanding My question is on polygomy. I understand why it happend in the prophets time, but whats happening now!!!??? I am strongly against it and cant imagine how any women could be happy sharing her husband. I would very much like some sort of islamic evidence suggesting that it is not viable in this day and age, or that the permission of the first wife is needed. Thank Allah i have grown up in a family who is strongly against polygomy, but worry that the man i will marry would have different views. Also to be honest i feel weak in my faith in the prophet (pbuh) every time i think about it, which is something i really hate. Im just left frustrated by this whole polygomy stuff! Any help on this question would be appreciated  |
Replies:
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 22 June 2009 at 7:24pm
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Asalaam Alaikum Pistacchio.. (Love the name...pistacchio by the way), I think if you ask Muslim women you will get a wide variety of views.. but most Muslim will not say it should not happen now. First it is not up to any of us to change the deen. We can choose if we want to be part of it. But to alter it or forbid it.. well.. I would say that most say it is not something Islamicallly we can do. Another point is that to say it is not necessary when women out number men is to not be realistic and to say those women are doomed to not marry. Three, yes many people do not practice it the correct way, or should I say men. But many people do not do marriage right period. That would be like we should outlaw it all, as many people are not very good at being a good partner. Permission of 1st wife. You will not find many, if any Islamic scholars saying it is correct to give 1st wife right of permission. Of course places do that. But it is not Islamic. We can view it personally with 'disfavor' but it is an option that some undertake. Think about the various conditions women are living under.. some are really not so hot.. and we are given the option.. to marry a man who is married to another that is OUR right. I met a sister in Pakistan who is the 2nd wife. She works, is well educated. She also walks with canes and is in a wheelchair at home. She men her husband at work. They got married. And frankly who am I to tell this woman she is wrong. Or take away one of her few options to be married.. to a respectable man who clearly took care of her. And it can be asked if you were raised in a more 'neutral' family regarding the issue would you have such a strong dislike? Not needing an answer just to ponder. Of course we all want the 'ideal' mate. But reality they are few and far between. The situations are all complicated. MANY people in monogamy or polygyny would change things if they could. Does my sister wish her husband would not drink? Yes. Can she change it. No. Honestly, for me, I had to take a step back and look at it from a less 'personal' view. It is part of the family, social and economic system of Islam. Who am I to say that it is not viable for some. It clearly is. I don't hate it. It is part of the fabric of our Ummah. Not a large part, but a part. I think it is important to meet or learn from women who are in polygyny. And let them be who they are. You can put into your marraige contract that you have a right to seek a 'divorce' if your husband marries another. Islamically you can not control him doing it. But you can end the marriage. And really there are no guarantees. The things I would worry about when I was 20 are not what I worry about now. Same for your husband. He may not want another wife and find he changed later on. So be it. You then still have a choice. And really, we should marry pious brothers.. and if there is already a shortage of men, finding a good, pious brother is all that much harder. If you want a link to meet women in polygyny just PM me. Yes they are out there. ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: samriha
Date Posted: 23 June 2009 at 6:50pm
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SALAM TO ALL SISTERS,
MY DEAR SISTER MY NAME IS SAMRIHA .I NEED TO LET YOU KNOW THAT I UNDERSTAND WHERE YOU COMMING FROM BUT I MUST AGREE WITH SISTER HAYFA.IT IS VERY HARD SOMETIMES BUT LIFE IS NOT ALWAYS WHAT IT SEEMS. MY SISTER IT CHOICES THAT WE MAKE IN LIFE.I AM A WOMAN IN POLYGYNY AND IT IS NOT BAD AS IT SEEMS, I MUST TELL YOU YES SOMETHIME IT IS HARD BUT WITH THE HELP OF ALLAH EVERY THING,WILL BE BACK TO GOOD. IF YOU ARE IN ISLAM YOU WILL UNDERSTAND AT LEAST TRY TOO .READ THE QURAN.AFTER ALL ISLAM IS THE WAY OF LIFE.
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Posted By: Chrysalis
Date Posted: 24 June 2009 at 1:57am
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Salammualaikum Dear Sis,
I hope Sis Hayfa and Samriha's responses helped. This is a sensitive issue for many muslim women (and nonmuslims) . . . understandably so.
Unfortunately sister, some social problems/issues are timeless. Allah in His Divine Wisdom knows that these problems will exist - if not worsen over time. Polygyny is a solution to these problems, even though one may not like it. Just like not all medicines and cures are pleasant - yet are a solution.
The social issues that existed during the Prophet's time, still exist today. If anything, some things have worsened. We still have more women in the society than men. . . and as time goes by, this ratio is going to be even more uneven.
However, despite the allowance for Polygyny bieng there - the percentage of men opting for polygyny is still less. Its not a common practise.
Samriha and Hayfa already addressed this. There is no such requirement of first wife's permission in Islam. However it is not your Islamic obligation to accept a polygynous marriage either, you can obtain a divorce.
If your husband has made up his mind about marrying someone else, there is nothing any person, law, or family member can do. Even if polygyny did not exist - there would still be husbands who would leave thier wives to marry others. This is something you cannot prevent or avoid. . . unfortunately this happens. Polygyny is not to blame. Banning Polygyny will not in anyway help reduce the number of straying men. I know a lot of women fear this about thier future - but the best attitude is not to kill yourself in worrying about hypothetical issues. Have trust in Allah and your fate. When things are not in your hands to change, the best option is to stop worrying and give Allah the burden we are trying to carry.
If you are worried about such things happen - you have a legal, islamic right to put it in your Nikah contract. Many muslim women do not know this, but Nikah is an open contract, in which both parties (bride & groom) can put in certain conditions - ofcourse the conditions need to be accepted and discussed by both parties. So you can put a condition in your Nikah contract that says your husband should not marry a 2nd wife. He will have to abide by these contractual conditions. Similarly, women can also put in conditions regarding Khulla etc that could make the divorce process easier for them. Basically any conditions that are acceptable can be put in the Nikah contract.
When I was in my early teens, I used to feel really dejected by the thought of Polygyny in Islam - but then I prayed to Allah, that He help me understand and accept the things in Islam that I dont understand due to my limited intellect. Alhamdulilah, after reading about Polygyny (and asking Q's) I came to terms with the concept and now I understand what logical wisdom lies behind Polygyny. It actually ends up working in the woman's benefit. So just have faith in Allah - and have faith in the fact that Allah is Just and Fair. . . He would NEVER be unfair to us.
Just because we dont understand something does not mean it is wrong. So, just make this dua and have faith. And until you gain the understanding about Polygyny - just dont think about it and focus on the aspects of Islam that you do find beautiful and understand.
As for the weakness in faith about the Prophet - I urge you to read some nice biography of the Prophet. I would suggest 'The Sealed Nectar' (Ar-raheeq Al-Makhtoum) by Safi Ur Rahman Mubarakpuri. It is a very nice biography that portrays the Prophet beautifully.
Don't forget, when our Prophet was just a young man, in the prime of his youth - 25 - he married his first wife Khadija who was a twice widowed lady of 45. He loved her immensley and she always retained a special place in his heart. . . he remained married to her for approx 25 years!!!! During this time, throughout his youth, she was his only wife! The year she died was named 'Aam ul Hazn' by him, and he was extremely saddened by her death. I find this relation of his with Khadija extremely touching, and makes me love him all the more. Subhanallah! Can any man ever surpass that act of his? or match this character of his?
May Allah help our Imaan and make us steadfast in our deen.
------------- "O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young." |
pistacchio wrote:Posted By: sophykhan
Date Posted: 24 June 2009 at 12:26pm
| i would like to talk about subject |
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 24 June 2009 at 6:34pm
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Salaams Sophy khan.. Welcome to the Forum. Please do share your thoughts Hayfa ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: ZEA J
Date Posted: 28 June 2009 at 3:12am
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I am in the process of divorcing my husband of almost nine years, because he marrying a second wife, eventhough I warned him not to. we got married when I was only 17 yrs old. I'm so angry with him that if I stay with him I'm going to commit a sin. Although we have children together, there is absulotely no way I can let him make me his "other" wife. So I completely understand how you feel about polygamy sister. ------------- "You will never attain piety and righteousness,(and eventually paradise)until you spend of that which you love."(Al-Imran:92) |
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 28 June 2009 at 5:56am
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Aslaam Alaikum, Zea J, you are right to know who you are.. and what you are about. It is NOT for all women. It is not for all men. Sometimes they marry and it causes problems later on. It is a blessing by Allah that your husband told you (or did you find out). And then YOU can decide what you want. And its fair and reasonable that you do not want these issues in your life. At least he is not lying and sneaking around. That is SO disrespectful. My Duas are with you. Hayfa ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: Nobody_Nobody
Date Posted: 03 July 2009 at 8:34pm
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Assalaamu alaikum wa rahmatullah wa barakatuh.
Since my childhood, I've always been a pro-polygamy. I do believe there are goodness in it. And because I believe no human is perfect, and i do think the imperfections that one have could be completed by the husband on the other wife.
If all we seek and have in our heart is the pleasure of Allah, swt, through the pleasure of our husband, then I think it'll be easy for us to swallow and accept polygamy, if we are the first wife.
This is a very good perspective of a first wife in polygamy...
http://www.polyganyfirstwife.com - http://www.polyganyfirstwife.com , For a second wife, she should be sensitive enough, that the first wife is hurt by that marriage and should be understanding to her. She should make her co-wife know that she is not there to snatch their husband away, but just like her [first wife] she [second wife] wants to benefit from the marriage too -- especially if the man is worth it [pious, of good character, etc.]
For the wives in the polygamy, I think if we keep in mind that the purpose of it is to gain Allah [swt's] pleasure, and following the sunnah of the prophet, saw, then it won't be a hassle. If we keep in mind that the purpose of polygamy is for the betterment of the society, it is easier to accept polygamy.
If we read and ponder on why polygamy was practiced, then we would appreciate and understand the beauty and benefits of polygamy...
Add to that the prevention of committing zina, helping the needy sis, providing a mahram to her and wali to the children... etc.
If you think the first wife, loses and is not gaining anything in this set up... I think it's just a matter of taking things through a positive angle... If she doesn't benefit for this dunya, then the pains that she endures, if she's enduring it to satisfy her husband, then inshaAllah she spiritually benefits from it.
For every pain we suffer, our sins are lessen...
Polygamy is also a jihad against our nafs... If we only think that jihad is not only going to the battlefield, and the jihad against our nafs is a greater jihad.
A good read: http://www.islamicawakening.com/viewarticle.php?articleID=275 - http://www.islamicawakening.com/viewarticle.php?articleID=275 &
just my thoughts...
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Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 04 July 2009 at 7:35pm
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Aslam Alaikum Nobody Nobody, Welcome to the forum. Where in Canada are you? I look forward to getting to know you. Hayfa ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 05 July 2009 at 6:21am
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Nobody Nobody, I agree with you wholeheartedly. Only women with great imaan can accept polygamy. They who know how to seek Allah's pleasure, will know the beauty behind this law. Polygamy is definitely not for the weak-hearted. Salam. ------------- Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention. |
Posted By: Chrysalis
Date Posted: 05 July 2009 at 8:32am
One should be careful with our choice of words sister. Hazrat Fatima (r.a) did not accept her husband's contemplation of a 2nd marriage during her life and complained to her father - our Prophet. Which led to the famous hadith: Fatima is a part of me. . he who hurts Fatima, hurts me.
------------- "O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young." |
Posted By: Nobody_Nobody
Date Posted: 05 July 2009 at 10:51pm
Waalaikum assalaam wa rahmatullah wa barakatuhu.
I'm in Toronto Sis. Jazakhallah.
I hope to frequent the forum, inshaAllah.
May we all benefit from this forum, ameen.
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Posted By: Shasta'sAunt
Date Posted: 06 July 2009 at 4:43am
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"through the pleasure of our husband, then I think it'll be easy for us to swallow and accept polygamy, if we are the first wife."
Assalamu Alaikum:
I think you have made an interesting choice of words.
It has always been my understanding that in Islam marriage is to be beneficial to both the husband and the wife. We are their garment and they are ours. We have mutual rights upon each other.
I am not sure why my husband's pleasure should outweigh mine to the point that I should swallow and accept something that I find hurtful and damaging.
Nor do I think that sisters who accept polygyny have greater Imaan than those who do not. Polygyny is not fard, it is not even necessary. I can probably think of at least a hundred things that should be considered more important in determining the character of a Muslim than polygyny.
Some say that sisters should accept it to make their husbands happy. I say, if a sister does not want a co-wife, what sort of a man would insist upon it? Not a husband that has any thought for the happiness of his current wife, so why would you need such a man?
If you are perfectly happy with the idea of polygyny then I think that is wonderful, but I don't think that those sisters whose opinions differ should have their Imaan belittled. ------------- �No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.� Eleanor Roosevelt |
Posted By: Nur_Ilahi
Date Posted: 07 July 2009 at 7:05am
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I know about this Hadith dear Sis. From what I understand, husbands who really understand what is the meaning of love, would appreciate the wives' love and would never ever want to hurt her feelings. Even our Great Prophet, when Khadijah was alive, he never took another wife. But at the same time, we should ask why is there this permission for polygamy? Why did Allah Al Aleem (Most Knowing) granted this permission? In most cases, men took advantage of this permission to the extent of hurting the wives' feelings. Many wives who could not take it prefer to be divorced than sharing the husband. However there are also cases where these women Redha and accept the husband's decision, not only for the sake of the family, but most importantly LILLAHITAALA! In fact I had read many examples of the first wives being the one that ask for the hand for marriage from the second one. I even have a second cousin who is the first wife and living under one roof with the second one together with their five children. If you ask me whether I could be like her. I do not know. ------------- Ilahi Anta Maksudi, Wa Redhaka Mathlubi - Oh Allah, You are my destination, Your Pleasure is my Intention. |
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 07 July 2009 at 9:45am
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Is it not always a balance between personal desires and the group or others?
------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: Nobody_Nobody
Date Posted: 09 July 2009 at 9:28pm
Salaam sis, I'm trying to pm you but I'm encountering error...
jazakhallah
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Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 10 July 2009 at 7:55pm
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walaikum salaam, I shall try also ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: sophykhan
Date Posted: 13 July 2009 at 10:38am
 thankyou everybody this is a great topic .i feel if my husband marry another he has a dislike upon me i dont know .i am white american different culture and also growing up here and seeing here everything .my husband is from pakistan he is the best man ever and so sweet .....some times we talk about pologamy i tell him its not a joke becauce it can hurt peoples feelings but i never experinced it i think it will be hard here maybe if we moved to another place or country it will be ok i think i am interested in helping him get a 2 wife???? idont know how and also worried about her if she will be ok with that i am 25 ,2 kids 7 and 4 will they be ok to see that????????
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Posted By: Chrysalis
Date Posted: 15 July 2009 at 2:50am
Don't even get me stated on that! Many muslim brothers think that it is amusing to joke around about Polygyny! Some are even dumb enough to do so with nonmuslims! We have a relative in Canada who tells us that there is an idiot gentleman in thier office who loves to joke around and tell nonmuslim ladies how he can marry upto 4!!! Grrrr. It is not funny! I wish our brothers would be sensible enough to know the importance and heaviness of words. Hadith says, words are like an arrow - once they leave the bow, they cannot come back.
Why would you be wanting to get your husband a second wife sis? Perhaps in a rush of faith/sympathy you do so - and later you regret it. Like said before: Polygyny is not easy - it is not for everyone - it is an exception, not the norm - it has not been 'reccommended' as an extra act of faith - it is just an allowance that exists, in order to deal with certain issues WHEN they occur. A man with 2 wives does not get anymore sawab than a man with 1 wife. If anything, he will be held even more responsible - and the probability of him sinning due to injustice will increase. Allah says in the Qur'an to the men, in verse 4:3 'but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then (marry) only one and later on, in the same chapter, Allah says to the men again: 4:129 " You shall never be able to maintain real equality between wives, even though you are eager to., so do not lean totally (towards one) and leave the other as suspended. If you act righteously and fear Allah, then, Allah is Most-Forgiving, Very-Merciful." So even to the men, Allah reccommends that they stick to one wife (under normal circumstances), since they will not be able to deal justly b/w more. ------------- "O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young." |
Posted By: martha
Date Posted: 15 July 2009 at 3:36am
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Chrysalis, you are right..men joke too often about having up to 4 wives. The impression it gives me is that they strut around like peacocks and actually give Islam a bad name in doing so. Polygany should only be practised if the man is a 'proper muslim' and goes about it carefully and respectfully and considers the feelings of the women involved. If he falls short of this then I would really doubt his understanding of having more than 1 wife. Moving to another country would not make it easier. Also remember that in Pakistan a man needs written consent from a 1st wife to proceed with a 2nd. (though my personal experience proved otherwise.) Obviously men flaunt the laws back home if it is for their convenience. That is very sad and destroys trust in a marriage.
Some would suggest that a 2nd wife is taken because he is not happy with the 1st. I suggest the man wants his cake and eat it too. To have 2 wives increases his social status maybe? ------------- some of us are a lot like cement:- all mixed up and permanently set |
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 15 July 2009 at 10:08am
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I think it is interesting that actually more men don't try to engage n polygyny... It is not a lot of men who do. It is obviously an intense subject for women.. I think we can learn alot to also see why most men do not engage in it in Islam. I think like anything else there a variety of reasons -happy with one wife -cannot afford it -fears Allah (cannot do it right, be just and in Islamic manner) -fears 1st wife.. lol -fears society / state authority -self-knowledge to know its not a good idea to try for themselves.. personal choice -knows having one wife is challenging enough, but having two.. mind boggling -thinks it is not permissable in Islam / misinformation ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: Chrysalis
Date Posted: 15 July 2009 at 10:21am
 ------------- "O Lord, forgive me, my parents and Muslims in the Hereafter. O Lord, show mercy on them as they showed mercy to me when I was young." |
Posted By: martha
Date Posted: 15 July 2009 at 12:26pm
Hehe....am sure men can only really cope with one wife...women on the other hand would have no trouble coping with 2 husbands  ------------- some of us are a lot like cement:- all mixed up and permanently set |
Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 15 July 2009 at 6:17pm
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Hehe....am sure men can only really cope with one wife...women on the other hand would have no trouble coping with 2 husbands
LOL, that is because we are really good at multi-tasking... hehe ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: sophykhan
Date Posted: 16 July 2009 at 12:58pm
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Posted By: martha
Date Posted: 16 July 2009 at 1:34pm
Very true Hayfa. I mean how many men i.e. can vacuum, dust, wash dishes and cook a meal all at the same time?  ......and still go food shop!...all in the space of an hour!!------------- some of us are a lot like cement:- all mixed up and permanently set |
Posted By: ZEA J
Date Posted: 23 September 2009 at 2:20am
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How dare you say such a thing to me. Just because I decided to not stay with my husband doesn't mean i have weak iman. You have such a judgemental and holire than thou attitude. And you know what sister, if you dont have anything good to say just keep quiet. OK! ------------- "You will never attain piety and righteousness,(and eventually paradise)until you spend of that which you love."(Al-Imran:92) |
Posted By: martha
Date Posted: 23 September 2009 at 6:34am
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Sister Zea,
DOn't worry about some comments...SOme Sisters are a little harsh I know.
I think you have shown great courage to divorce your husband. Whatever you feel is best for you is fine. I don;t think Nur Ilahi has to share her husband with another woman, so I don't think she fully understands.
Salaams
------------- some of us are a lot like cement:- all mixed up and permanently set |
Posted By: Full of Hopes
Date Posted: 23 September 2009 at 8:31am
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Asslamu Alaikum Wa Rahmatu Allah Sisters may Allah forgive us. There are two kinds of topics: 1- Islamic issues 2- non- Islamic (social- medical.. and so on) As Muslims, when Allah says or states that something is permitted or forbidden we have to accept it immediately and never argue about it. If we are Muslims, then everything form Allah is to be fine, correct, fair and accepted, otherwise we are not true Muslims. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - Quraan: file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - 2.85 file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - and do ye reject the rest? but what is the reward for those among you who behave file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - like file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - o file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - If we accept the part that we like in Islam and reject the part that we feel it difficult, then the previous eye tells about us. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - Dears, this is the true religion that Allah has chosen for us and Has put everything fair and right. But sometimes our human minds just do not understand it. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - Please fear Allah and do not dare to argue about our basic rules which are stated by Allah. Hijab, polygamy are like hajj and praying all are form Allah. And we are not Muslims if we do not believe in them form Allah and accept them even without trying to ask why. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - (4.65 file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - judge in all disputes between them, and find in
their souls no resistance, against
Thy file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - But in some cases, some women are so weak and sensitive to handle polygamy. And in this case, this is out of her control. She goes to the judge and explain her situation. For any excuse like what the sister said that she fears to commit a sin. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - Frankly,I do not care if you disagree with me!! Actually, when this is from Allah's religion, we do not even argue. Maybe I care of your opinion in the issues which are related to our life, work, social problems, family life and so on but WHEN ALLAH SAYS TO SOMETHING YES I AND YOU HAVE TO SAY: WE ACCEPT and never argue. We educate the person who ask in a good way and tell that Allah knows the best. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - (33.36 - disobeys God and His Apostle, he is indeed on a clearly wrong Path.) file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - I know some of you will say because of the Saudi culture or I do not understand because I am not married or because I do not how women feel. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - I am not married but I understand when the woman loves her husband and, she can not imagine he thinks about another woman and it kills her to think of sleeping with another woman. I am a woman and I understand. But polygamy is from Allah, we believe in Him and accept everything form Him. It is not the mater of arguing. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - I am the most jealous and if my hubby wanted another wife I will let him do it and accept it but as a human being I know I will cry and feel sad for some time, but before and after everything, I love Allah more the any man and Allah wants this so I want it and accept it. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - There are some suggested reasons answering why polygamy is good for the society. I have studied them before but I am sorry I am not free now. But I will soon post them to answer the question. file:///C:%5CUsers%5CSahumah%5CAppData%5CLocal%5CTemp%5Cmsohtml1%5C01%5Cclip_filelist.xml - -------------  And whoever seeks a religion other than Isl�m, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers(3:85)
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Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 23 September 2009 at 9:41am
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Aslaam Alaikum Full of Hopes I pray you had a wonderful Eid. I agree it is not up to any Muslim to make what is halal- haram. Some people honestly get confused with the parameters to any marriage. All women and men have Rights and Responsibilities. We read on the internet or hear from someone else and we end up gonig down the wrong path. We do have to accept that polygyny is one option. And the blessing of Allah is we can choose. A husband may marry another wife and the 1st or 2nd or 3rd can say it is a hardship for them to live this way. What a true blessing of Allah! You know in Catholicism, you could not divorce. Yes it is not recommended in Islam but it is allowed. The blessing of Islam is that often we have choices. Women and Men can choose to be in polygyny or not. But it is not up to any of us to say it is haram. Allah is most merciful! Hayfa ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |
Posted By: Shasta'sAunt
Date Posted: 23 September 2009 at 11:36am
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Salaams,
I don't think anyone here said that polygyny is haram. But khula is not haram either and thanks to Allah's Mercy women have the option of leaving a situation that they personally cannot abide. ------------- �No one can make you feel inferior without your consent.� Eleanor Roosevelt |
Posted By: Full of Hopes
Date Posted: 23 September 2009 at 12:13pm
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Yeh you did not say haram but some women mock the religion in this point and say they do not accept this part. I mean if a woman does not accept it, this has to be her private life and she has to have her reasonable reasons, but saying that it is not accepted in this general way is not allowed in Islam. Sisters, I am just giving a general advice do not worry if you are sure of your self and faith. I am addressing the people who do not agree. That is all. My point is accept everything form Allah and never argue, never say in general it is not fair or not accepted. That maybe clearer if I quite some of sisters comments here that show they just do not accept Allah judgment on this point. But I followed the way of prophet Muhammed peace be upon him, he was never direct in saying names of people who commit the mistake. He used to say, why does someone do this or that. That is why the general way is great for giving an advice, if it is you or someone else she will get it and understand. I am sure that your hearts are full of faith and love to Allah but sometimes we need someone to remind us and then we remember and renew our Imaan. If I have any doubt of your faith, I would have never remind you. You are the best and I see you are all full of faith and respect to Allah, the greatest. We are sisters do not forget. We remind each other and accept the advice form each other. We are against mistakes not against people. Happy Eid to all of you.. ------------- And whoever seeks a religion other than Isl�m, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers(3:85)
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Posted By: martha
Date Posted: 23 September 2009 at 1:25pm
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Full Of Hopes, Salaams,
I have never said polygany is wrong. It is how men go about it that is sometimes wrong. Women can be and are often hurt by the actions of their husbands regarding poygany. For example I gave the instance of a man who recently told me he would be separated from his wife for some time..(this is because their baby is very sick and needs medical attention abroad.) He has told his wife that whilst she is away he will take another wife because he can't live without sex for that time. Now personally I would have said his way of thinking is haram. He could choose to travel with his wife...there is no restrictions on that. Imagine how his current wife feels then? She is a revert, and has agreed for him to marry again. But actually does she have any choice? He also has a choice and can live without sex if he really wanted to.
Shasta's Aunt has also pointed out that khulla is not haram. If a woman cannot abide a situation in marraige then I see it as a blessing from Allah that she has a way out. Divorce is not to be taken lightly, neither is marriage, neither is polygany.However I believe that only a small portion of good muslim men marry more than one woman for the right reasons as was taught by our beloved Prophet(pbuH).
As Hayfa has pointed out polygany is only an option, not obligatory, or Muhammad(pbuH) would have said otherwise. I doubt there are many sisters that will actually say polygany is wrong...only that it is not for them. That is a completely different issue. ------------- some of us are a lot like cement:- all mixed up and permanently set |
Posted By: Full of Hopes
Date Posted: 23 September 2009 at 4:16pm
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Wa Alaikum Asslam You are right, sister Martha. Many men are doing haram in this. I know stories that will make you cry. Many men are selfish. And this man is doing something wrong when he treated a new Muslims in such an such a bad way. He will be punished if Allah did not forgive him but she also is rewarded. Also, if a woman can not handle it as you said there is the khula. Sisters, we have to be will educated about women rights in Islam. Allah did not make polygamy without conditions or rules. Just read about polygamy in Quraan and Sunna. There is a painful punishment for the man who is not keeping Allah rules in polygamy. Sisters I did not say, men must do it. Please do not misunderstand me. I know how some men are not fair and are really think like animals of sex only. I know that but I am saying in the true Islam polygamy is accepted but with the condition of being fair with the wives. ------------- And whoever seeks a religion other than Isl�m, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers(3:85)
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Posted By: ZEA J
Date Posted: 24 September 2009 at 1:28am
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I agree with sister Hayfa...most men that I know, especially the religious onse, don't take a second wife for fear that they might not be able to treat them equally. My ex-husband marry his wife because all of his brothers have more than one wives, and so they always brag to him how wonderful and fun it is to have multiple wivse and so many children. But he claimed the reasons he took a second wife were because his mom forced him to and the fact that I did not want to have any more children until I finish school. I know that this divorce is going to be very difficult for my children, all of whom are under the age of 10, but I hope and pray to Allah that everything goes smooth and easy for us. ------------- "You will never attain piety and righteousness,(and eventually paradise)until you spend of that which you love."(Al-Imran:92) |
Posted By: martha
Date Posted: 24 September 2009 at 5:43am
Salaams Sister Zea,
I will pray for you. I know how hard it is faced with this situation. My husband took another wife after 3 years marriage back in Pakistan...he didn't tell me till he returned to the UK six months later. He also said his mom forced him to do so. As hard as I tried he was not prepared to see me through an adjustment process and was totally unIslamic about the whole thing. It was not the polygamy aspect I could not handle..it was his deceit with me. Many members here know my story. He also wanted his British passport which he needed me for. Life has not gone well for him since I stopped my support. BUt I am moving on with life and am contented to be on my own at this time.
I hope it will go smoothly for you and the children. Fortunately for me I had no children with my Pak husband...
I am certain you will come through this stronger...and insha'allah you will find another husband that is deserving of you.
Peace sister. All will be well I am sure. ------------- some of us are a lot like cement:- all mixed up and permanently set |
Posted By: Full of Hopes
Date Posted: 24 September 2009 at 6:45am
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Sister Martha, I can add nothing to you. You said everything I signed in to tell sister Zea J. May Allah support us and make it easy for us to obey Him. ------------- And whoever seeks a religion other than Isl�m, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers(3:85)
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Posted By: www.islam.in.th
Date Posted: 30 September 2009 at 9:00pm
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Islam's Position on Polygamy
Written by Dr. Bilal Philips Thursday, 06 July 2006 www.islam.in.th Muslims are often accused of being promiscuous because polygamy is legal in Islam. 2. Monogamy of the West inherited from Greece and Rome where men were restricted by law to one wife but were free to have as many mistresses among the majority slave population as they wished. In the West today, most married men have extramarital relations with mistresses, girlfriends and prostitutes. Consequently the Western claim to monogamy is false. 3. Monogamy illogical. If a man wishes to have a second wife whom he takes care of and whose children carry his name and he provides for he is considered a criminal, bigamist, who may be sentenced to years in jail. However, if he has numerous mistresses and illegitimate children his relation is considered legal. 4. Men created polygamous because of a need in human society. There is normally a surplus of women in most human societies.1 The surplus is a result of men dying in wars, violent crimes and women outliving men.2 The upsurge in homosexuality further increases the problem. If systems do not cater to the need of surplus women it will result in corruption in society. Example, Germany after World War II, when suggestions to legalize polygamy were rejected by the Church. Resulting in the legalization of prostitution. German prostitutes are considered as workers like any other profession. They receive health benefits and pay taxes like any other citizen. Furthermore, the rate of marriage has been steadily declining as each succeeding generation finds the institution of marriage more and more irrelevant. 5. Western anthropologists argue that polygamy is a genetic trait by which the strongest genes of the generation are passed on. Example, the lion king, the strongest of the pack, monopolizes the females thereby insuring that the next generation of lion cubs will be his offspring. 6. Institutional polygamy prevents the spread of diseases like Herpes and AIDS. Such venereal diseases spread in promiscuous societies where extra-marital affairs abound. 7. Polygamy protects the interests of women and children in society. Men, in Western society make the laws. They prefer to keep polygamy illegal because it absolves them of responsibility. Legalized polygamy would require them to spend on their additional wives and their offspring. Monogamy allows them to enjoy extra-marital affairs without economic consequence. 8. Only a minority will practice polygamy in Muslim society. In spite of polygamy being legal in Muslim countries, only 10-15% of Muslims in these countries practice polygamy. Although the majority of men would like to have more than one wife, they cannot afford the expense of maintaining more than one family. Even those who are financially capable of looking after additional families are often reluctant due to the psychological burdens of handling more than one wife. The family problems and marital disputes are multiplied in plural marriages. 9. Conditions have been added for polygamy in many Muslim countries. For example, in Egypt, the permission of the first wife must first be obtained. This and similar conditions are a result of colonial domination. No woman in her right mind will give her husband permission to take a second wife. Such a condition, in fact, negates the permission given by God in the Qur'an. 10. Others have accepted polygamy on condition that it not be for �lust�. That is, if the wife is ill, or unable to bear children, or unable to fulfill the husband's sexual needs, etc., taking a second wife is acceptable. Otherwise it becomes �lust� on the husband's part and is consequently not acceptable. The reality is that �lust� was involved in the marriage of the first wife. Why is it acceptable in the case of the first and not the second? As has already been pointed out, men are polygamous by nature. To try to curb it by such conditions will only lead to corruption in society. 11. Feminists may object to this male right by insisting that women should also be able to practice polygamy. However, a woman marrying four husbands would only increase the problem of surplus women. Furthermore, no child would accept his or her mother identifying the father by the �eeny meeny miney mo� method. The question which remains is, �If God is good and wishes good for His creatures, why did he legislate something which would be harmful to most women?� Divine legislation looks at the society as a whole seeking to maximize benefit. If a certain legislation benefits the majority of the society and causes some emotional harm to a minority, the general welfare of society is given precedence. ------------- www.islam.in.th |
Posted By: Sabran ya nafsi
Date Posted: 21 October 2009 at 1:03am
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Assalamu alaykum to all of you,
I'm coming a little late to this discussion, but I hope you won't mind my putting my 2 cents worth in. First of all, I'm new here, and I usually don't register on forums, but after reading this post, I thought that I would comment.
Polygyny is definitely a contentious topic, and it is a topic that is discussed the muslim world over, by both men and women. Of course usually the men are for it, and the women are against it.
Let's look at this in the historical context. At the time of the prophet , peace be upon him, polygyny and polyandry were practiced. Polygyny more so,but if you read the hadith of A'isha, may Allah be pleased with her, where she describes the types of marriage practiced in pre-islamic times, it does show that polyandry was also practiced. When Islam came, it did away with that, and then regulated the practice of polygyny. It was very common for men to have many wives, in fact for a man to have only one wife was the exception. Many of the sahabah had more than four wives when they entered Islam, and the Prophet Mohammed, sala Allahu alayhi wa salam, would order them to choose 4 of them and divorce the rest. When Ghaylan ibn Salamah embraced Islam he had 10 wives. The Prophet, Sala Allahu alayhi wa salam, told him, "retain four of them and separate from the rest." Qays ibn al-Harith also said, "I embraced Islam while having eight wives. I came to the Prophet, sala Allahu alayhi wa salam and told him that and he said, "Choose four of them.". Omar ibn al-Khattab, radi Allahu anhu, also had many wives, and the Prophet, Sala Allahu alayhi wa salam, also told him to choose four, so Islam came and regulated this practice.
Many of the sahabiah would remarry many times if they were divorced, or if their husbands died. Asma' bint Umais was married many times. She was married to Ja'far ibn Abi Taleb, and bore him children, she was married by Abu Bakr AsSadiq after Jafar was martyred, and bore him at least one son, and after Abu Bakr passed away, she was married by Ali ibn Abi Taleb,and bore him a child as well. Do you think that it was concievable that she was married to all of these different husbands as an only wife?. Abu Bakr, radi Allahu anhu, also had multiple wives, as Asma, and A'isha were from different mothers.
Concerning the hadith that women always use to show that the prophet,Sala allahu alayhi wa salam did not like for Ali to marry another wife with Fatimah, this hadith is misunderstood and taken out of context. The reason that the Prophet, Sala Allahu alayhi wa salam, asked Ali to break off the engagement that he had made, was not because he didn't want Ali to marry again, it was because he had engaged the daughter of Abu Jahl. The Prophet told Ali that the daughter of the prophet of Allah, and the daughter of the enemy of Allah could not be married to the same man at the same time. Then he said Fatimah is a part of me, what hurts Fatimah hurts me. And Allahu alam. There is also another hadith that says that the Prophet, sala Allahu alayhi wa salam, gave Ali a piece of cloth and told him to divide it amongst the women of his household. If Fatimah was the only wife, who were the other women of his household? Possibly slaves? Yes, possibly , but we all know that men were allowed to have sexual relations with their slave girls, so wouldn't this also hurt Fatimah. And did the Prophet, sala Allahu alyhi wa salam have a different standard for Fatimah than for the rest of the women? No he didn't, because we all know that he said, if Fatimah, bint Mohammed were to steal, I would have her hand cut off.
What is my point with all of this? It's just to show that polygyny was the norm at that time. In fact polygyny in Islam is something that has been quite common up until recent times. As was stated in the post above monogamy is a western idea that has influenced Islam in the present time. When the Islamic countries were occupied by the European countries is when monogamy became more common. And of course why was this concept of monogamy introduced , but to weaken Islam. Fewer marriages= fewer children=fewer Muslims. And fewer marriages=increased vice, and weakened family structure.
Islamic society has suffered directly as a result of the increase of monogamy, There is an increase in the numbers of single women, never been married, widoed, and divorced. Don't you think that many of these women would like to be married and have a man to take care of her even if she had to be a co-wife.
Now let's look at whether there is a need in present day society for polygyny. People will say that in the past there was greater need ,and that today women shouldn't have to put up with polygyny. Let's see what has really changed. People will say well, they used to marry widows to take care of them at times of war. I ask you, Are there now no wars going on in any land of Islam???????? We all know the answer to that one. People will say but it's not the custom any more, to that I will say see previous paragraph. People will say that men should be able to control their desires. To that I say, What are the men seeing out in the street every day. They are seeing women dressed very immodestly, to say the least. Let's face it, Allah, subhanahu wa ta'ala, put a strong sexual drive into most men. To just tell people to control it without giving them an outlet doesn't work. If it did there wouldn't be all the cheating, and promiscuity that there is in the western world, and increasingly in the muslim world.
To the girl who said that she is afraid that she might marry a man who will want to get another wife, Yes you might, but you can't live your life worrying about what ifs. Not one of us knows what will happen to us tomorrow. We aren't 'alam al ghaib to see into the future. He might, he might not.
About putting a condition in the marriage contract that a husband can't marry another wife. I have heard scholars say, and have read in books , that even if a husband agrees to this condition in a contract it is not valid, and that he doesn't have to follow it, because the permission to marry more than one is given by Allah, ta'ala, so a woman doesn't have the right to make that a condition. Whether it is acceptable to make divorce a condition if he marries another wife, I don't know about that. What I do know is that the prophet gave a severe warning about women asking for divorce or khula. Khula is not actually divorce, it is more like annullment, and the husband has no right to take the wife back, because what she has done is essentially bought her freedom. Therefore a wife should think long and hard about asking for khula, because it can't be undone. There are no three khulas. It is irrevocable from the first. The iddah period is also not the same. It is only one monthly period. The prophet, sala Allahu alayhi wa salam warned against it in this hadith: Thawban narrated that the Prophet, Sala Allahu alayhi wa salam said,For any woman who asks her husband for a divorce without anything wrong being done , the scent of Paradise will be forbidden for her". This hadith is sahih, recorded by Tirmidhi, Abu Dawood , and Ibn Majah. And he also narrated that the Prophet, sala Allahu alayhi wa salam, said " Those women who seek to pay for a divorce (from their husbands) are hypocrites." This hadith is also sahih, recorded by Tirmidhi . This information about khula was taken from "The concise presentation of the Fiqh"by Dr. Abdul-Azeem al Badawi. So this is a very strong warning to women.
And to those who say that she doesn't know what it feels like. Yes I do, I'm the first of three wives. It hurts, but life goes on and you get over it, but I didn't say it was easy.
Lastly I would like to recommend a book "From monogamy to Polygyny: A Way Through by Umm AbduRahman Hirschfelder and Um Yasmeen Rahman published by DarusSalam
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Posted By: Hayfa
Date Posted: 22 October 2009 at 1:30pm
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Asalaam Alaikum Sabran, Thank you for your post and welcome to the Forum. Hayfa ------------- When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi |