justice between man and woman?
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Category: Religion - Islam
Forum Name: General Islamic Matter
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URL: https://www.islamicity.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=30354
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Topic: justice between man and woman?
Posted By: Mihs
Subject: justice between man and woman?
Date Posted: 18 July 2014 at 4:36am
Aoa. I want to ask a question that has been disturbing for a while now. I hope to get help from you soon. Islam allows men to have four wives and also keep the slave women. While the woman is to be loyal to her husband soleley. Is it fair towards a wife? She has to tolerate her husband being with many other women but has to be with him only? Justice? Then she has to please her husband whatever or however the husband may be. His displeasure could cause her to be in hell. But if he doesn`t fulfill all the wife`s rights, there`s simply no threat or punishment for men. They are just given a relaxed hand to treat their wives any way they want, and the wife has to be obedient no matter what. Even if she tolerated all this with patience solely for the reward of the hereafter, she again finds out that shell has to be with her husband in Jannah and not only him but his hoorein as well. Is it fair? Fine I know there will be no feelings of jealousy then but about now? Allah has given us feelings now in this world. How a woman will feel to know that she has to be loyal to a person who can have as many slave women to enjoy in this world and will have hoors in hereafter? A woman merely demands love and loyalty from a relatioship, why has Allah ignored her feelings just to fulfil a man`s wishes.? Does Islam favours men? And then a woman is made all dependent on man. She isn't allowed to have a second of freedom without husband`s permission. She like a caged bird in Islam. All the time spent in pleasing a husband who can be pleased by many women. And if she asks for divorce she`ll end up in hell. But a husband can throw her off whenever he wants and only the wife would be blamed for displeasing her husband. They are always dependent on men for finance can't even build up their self esteem by working without a husband`s permission. What are women given in this world and the hereafter? Is it fair? Please don't compare Islamic status with pure Islamic status of women. Islam considers the pleasures of men only. In all Quranic verses and sunnah, the word men is used. Please clarify in detail.
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Replies:
Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 26 July 2014 at 10:57pm
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Assalamalecum,Allah in Quran had given equal rights to both men and women, in some cases Allah gave upper hand to women and in some cases to men, but overall result is equality.regarding question to have 4 wives.Allah in ch 4 v 3 of Quran says it is permissible for you to have wives upto 4 but u have to ensure justice among them, if not it is better to have one.look at this verse Allah is giving a facility but also responsibility,the reason Allah allowed concept of 4 wives is because if u observe female infants are stronger than male infants and mortality rate of male infants is higher as compared to females so therefore female population exceeds male population, in europe and usa female population exceeds by millions, so think if there is a situation in which all men are married then there will b some girls unmarried so the best way is to marry a married man and achieve a status in society rather than to live alone.Allah in ch 4 v 34 regards men as khaiyyam for women . Unfortunately many take wrong meaning of word khaiyyam,actually it means protector.Allah in ch 4 v 19 says it is unlawful for you to inherit woman under compulsion.now tell me this verse signifies the gr8 respect for woman.Allah says to take care about feelings of woman.how u can say Allah gave men the preference.in fact Allah dislikes the making of face gloomy on birth of girl child in ch 16 v 58-59 of Quran.unfortunately people are way away from Quran and they had developed their own rulings for eg not letting women study.our prophet Muhammad S.A.W (pbuh) said it is obligatory for every man n woman to gain knowledge.Allah in ch 96 v 1-5 is addressing to whole mankind-recite in the name of Allah who created from clay, recite inthe name of Allah who taught u that u ddidn't know, recite and Allah is the doer of gr8 things.i recommend you to read Quran with translation and don't hear or give importance to those who didn't have knowledge and create their own rulings.Allahfiz.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 29 July 2014 at 1:44am
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Thankyou.. nd well answered.. but you didn't answer all my questions.. u just gave an overview that girls are equally important in islam.. please try and answer one and all of my questions separately.. Thankyou for the effort you made.
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 31 July 2014 at 2:41am
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Assalamalecum,ur first question how would wife feel if husband is with other women??? Firstly if u really love Allah you have to obey and be satisfied with all commandments, as it is mentioned if a man can afford to have another wife he can provided that he had to ensure justice,so u can't complain about the freedom of having wives to a man, because its the verse of Allah.think practically that if a situation arises as I mentioned in my previous post, definitely 2 or 4 wives will depend on man for financial and other necessesities so now a role of being a Muslim comes that to acquire peace by submitting will to Allah, means to sacrifice ur willings n obey Allah.u say that we men will be provided with hoors in hereafter but to attain that reward we have to strive,means if a man is good towards his wife then only he will attain salvation.so if u claim to love Allah u have to obey commandments irrespective of ur willing.like eg we will score a sin ifwe men knowingly beat our wives but Allah made it lawful for us only when if a wife is found gguilty of adultery even after warning for 3 times then we r allowed to beat in such a way not to have a scar on her (ch 4 v 34), now u will ask what is the punishment for men for adultery, answer is given by Allah for whole in ch 24 v 2 is 100 lashes.i will answer seperately every question only after ur response to my each answer.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 05 August 2014 at 12:35pm
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Ofcourse, when one loves Allah, s/he will submit to Him. But why is this compromise of nafs/feelings asked from women only? Compromise on husband sharing, on independence, on wanting to travel around the world, on wanting to be the one whom parents are proud of, ... Why? Why not men have to compromise anything except their money? I wud rather give up my money than be a second hand human being, inferior to men, I wud rather strive and fight and give my life in the way of Allah than be caged at home, I wud rather live alone than with a shared husband, I wud rather work in sun and provide money for my family than relax at home, u see nothing is being asked of from men to compromise, they earn their own living, rather everyone's dependent on them.
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 06 August 2014 at 9:22am
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But who said u to stay at home???? Who said u to sacrifice ur needs?? Read Quran there is nothing in it to stop u from leading ur life but to lead ur life under shariah,in fact ch 4 v 19 had a broader meaning by this verse I can't even force u to do my paper work sacrifice is way away.its because some people who say that they claim to have knowledge of Quran say this,I tell u u shud focus on reading and implementing Quran and forget what people say, u say we men are not ordered to sacrifice,read ch 24 v 30-31 in which Allah ordered us modesty for men first and then women.if u observe there are several women who work and take care of houses MashaAllah,don't make impression of islam by listening to others, read Quran, if ur intention is clear nothing to worry about others, as a person I believe in full freedom of women because I fear Allah.in Quran there is noverse that prohibits women from independent living but u have to follow shariah.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 07 August 2014 at 12:13am
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I am not saying anything about sacrificing needs.. Its about sacrificing wishes.. That which u require not but want.. Men do not have to compromise any of their wishes... But women HAVE TO SACRIFICE THEIR WISHES AND WANTS AFTER MARRIAGE... now u see what I m saying.. Men can fulfill their wishes whenever and however they want but WOMEN can't without the permission of husbands except those few lucky ones who have got sensible husbands.. If u say that they could have it in their marriage contract then their wud be no rishtas/proposals for her.. And then all the blame wud cum on the woman and that now she wud remain unmarried for a long time... But Islam gives no punishment or fear to men who suppress women's rights, but it all the time suppresses and frightens women for not pleasing husband and this and that. Its all about frightening women. Now do u have anything to say in defense.. Doesn't it say so? U are only one of a few who believe in women freedom.
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 08 August 2014 at 10:22am
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Assalamalecum,who says we men can't be punished for supressing rightsof women??? Read ch 4 v 19 the ccompulsion.what do u mean by this? ?? It means that to force someone to go against his wish.so Allah forbids that and whatever we do the forbidden thing definitely we will be penalised unless we repent.u accept that few lucky ones who got sensible husbands, well look this is not problem of islam it is problem of community and yes I agree that most men even litterate ones does this but for their acts we can't say islam is wrong.no.Islam is the religion that if we follow nicely in Sha Allah everybody will be happy and satisfied.i ask u to read and understand Quran daily one page and then u will have a different vision about life.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 08 August 2014 at 12:39pm
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What do you say about that serving husband, prostrating husband ( that hadis), half a man's testimony, Prophet pbuh saying women r deficient in mind and religion.? Isn't it discrimination b/w genders? Allah would not forgive a women who is best to her parents but not to husband , ( even if she is fighting the husband to let her work for example) even then Allah wud punish her for displeasing husband and going against his wishes even if she is merely demanding her rights? Could u just tell me its justice? And one more thing does the Quran, from A to Z addresses only men?
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 08 August 2014 at 8:41pm
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Assalamalecum,prophet Muhammad S.A.W (pbuh) always prommoted respect of women.from where u heard these incidents??? I tell u one-therewas a young girl, her marriage was ffixed against her will, she then complained to the prophet and the prophet there itself dissolve that marriage.Prophet Said that the mother is the person in this world who deserves our love the most.Prophet said whoever raises the two daughters with love and affection till their youth, on judgement day will b very close to me.where it is written prostrating husband that's wrong wrong wrong.we all have to bow only in front of Allah.moreover again the role of a muslim comes if both husband and wife reads Quran daily then many problems will be solved, eg if wife refuse to mate with husband, husband on his part should b patient.that's wrong that Allah would not forgive if u r good to parents but not to husband,,but if u r arrogant or u torture him and not repent then Allah may not forgive, u have to be good both to parents(As Allah commands us to be good to parents in ch 17 v 23-24), and to husband, being good doesn't mean that u have to serve him like boss.once again I say understand Quran and read authentic hadeeth.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 09 August 2014 at 11:48pm
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What if the husband tortures wife...? If he is arrogant? He wouldn't be punished. Disobeying a husband leads to jahannum even if that is to fulfill a mother's task and he doesn't let u without any reason. Prophet said that the person would be close to me ... He said this about only men and not women .. What abt women, who helps rather have a main part in raising children.. But still no awards for them for raising daughters. U know that incident when there was a people of a place who were all very bad.. Angel asked who among this would enter Hannah. Allah said there is one person. Angel followed that person to see what good he does and found that he served his mother to an extreme. But u see this respect of mother's is for sons only.. For a daughter she is always taught to serve the husband however he is.. U know serving a mother u feel gud becz she is elder than u and has brought u up and senior in relations.. But in a relation which promotes equality such as marriage.. Why does one spouse asked to serve the other .. If he works then she also works at home so u see both work.. Both get I'll and tired then why does one have to serve other and obey him.. Even if she is a spiritual and sane Muslim .. Why she has to listen to his yelling and scolding .. While a wife cannot do so when he does something wrong.. ? If she serves the mother to extreme and husband doesn't want her to .. But she disobeys and serves her old and ill mother the way the man in the incident did .. But still would u expect her to be called jannnati the way Allah called the man in the incident as she has disobeyed her husband? Even if the husband in this case is wrong?
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 11 August 2014 at 3:07am
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Assalamalecum,if husband tortures wife or he is arrogant towards him, Allah hates him because Allah in ch 16 v 23 of Quran says Allah hates the arrogant person.now I m quoting a hadeeth as I heard from a maulana that prophet Muhammad ( pbuh) once said if a wife is obedient to a husband, pray 5 time salaah, and do all obligations, all 8 gates of paradise are opened to her.obligation of love for mother is for both men and women.prophet Muhammad S.A.W (pbuh) said one of the best believers isthe one who is good to hhis relatives, especially the wife.hazrat aisha (may Allah be plzd with her) said Prophet Muhammad S.A.W (pbuh) himself did lot of household work think the leader of prophets (pbut all), the man whom Allah loves the most,the best man ever till the end himself did household work and respected women which gives the biggest message for respect of women to all of us.but unfortunately its the people who had created innovations and lead to falz beliefs for Allah only one thing matters I.e taqwa.Allah in ch 49 v 13 says Allah created mankind from a couple and divided us into different regions, colours and the best among you is the one who is close to Allah, who posess righteousness.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 11 August 2014 at 8:53am
Prophet said wife will never see paradise if she ask for divorce. What abt men who give divorce without any reason or for another woman.?
And u yourself said, wife has to be obedient to husband, is it in all matters? And what about husband who is doing something wrong, and wife corrects him, but there is nothing that husband should obey. Islam talks like women are too senseless and st**id.
What if the mother calls the daughter and husband asks her not to go without any reason, what then?
What about wives and women not being allowed to pursue their dreams, if they want to work or do something or go abroad? They have to obey. While men can live and enjoy and go and do whatever they want.
Husband can even live without wife abroad for six months .. :-(
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 13 August 2014 at 3:48am
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Assalamalecum,remember one thing, Allah in Quran in ch 4 v 40 says Allah is never unjust even in the least degree.moreover do you know there is a seperate surah named Surah An Nisa I.e ch 4.this automatically indicares the importance of women in islam and Allah says in ch 3 v 160 if Allah is with u none can overcome u if Allah forsakes u then there is who can save u let the believers put trust in Allah.therefore if u trust Allah u willb successful both in this world n hhereafter in Sha Allah.
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 13 August 2014 at 9:36am
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Allah in ch 33 v 35 says that for every believing men n women there is reward of forgiveness from Allah.Allah in ch 48 v 5 says Allah will admit righteuos men n women to jannah.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 13 August 2014 at 11:40pm
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I know .. But if a situation arises in which she has to do what seems right .. Even if it means leaving husband for the mother's sake.. Would Allah understand? That even though she left her husband , she did that for the right thing?
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 13 August 2014 at 11:44pm
OK now here's a problem a friend of mine is facing..
She is a married to a person who doesn't let her do work she desires , her work requires travelling. Although she made it a verbal point before her nikkah that she would work.. And he agreed. Now he isn't allowing her to work.. But she's told by the men of her family that she shouldn't get a divorce or else she'll be a sinner.
Would u suggest that is she allowed to divorce..?
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 14 August 2014 at 11:42pm
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Assalamalecum,I would suggest your friend to read Quran from ch 2 v 224 onwards in which Allah described the rules of divorce.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 20 August 2014 at 1:21am
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Can't you please give me a reply in detail.. I cannot find anything regarding this problem..
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 20 August 2014 at 1:23am
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Aoa. Another question I would like to ask but only if u will give me a reply .. In detail ... ND not just suggesting verses.. May I ask?
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 26 August 2014 at 9:16am
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U just put ch 2 v 224 of Quran on google and u will get it.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 27 August 2014 at 10:12am
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In Quran it says 'man' almost everywhere , does it refer to men only?
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 27 August 2014 at 10:15am
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There is nothing regarding my question about my friend.. Is it OK if she separates?
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Posted By: NABA
Date Posted: 28 August 2014 at 1:43am
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Read Surah Al talaq ch 65 of Quran with translation.
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Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 28 August 2014 at 7:32am
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Mihs, what is the distance of travel required for her work? Generally speaking there is no contract greater than a marriage contract, and if he agreed, then he should honor the contract. However, nothing can be placed into a marriage contract that goes against the shariah, and even if agreed to, it is void. She should present her case to a local judge for disposition.
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 29 August 2014 at 1:53am
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Requires travelling to different countries... Isn't it a hadis that a spouse should keep all the promises made in the contract.. And that distance specified .. Is it in Quran or hadis? Wasn't it said for safety purposes.. And yes today in planes there is no safety risk for miles and miles of travelling .. The only threat is plane crashing ... That threat is for men too ... In previous days , they used to travel by camel on roads.. So obvious it was dangerous... Many scholars believe this.. So which scholars to follow? Can she separate now?
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Posted By: abuayisha
Date Posted: 30 August 2014 at 7:50am
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Indeed the scholars differ on women traveling unaccompanied. This matter, in my estimation, is best worked out according to what the local scholars and the husband, along with his wife, can agree upon. Hopefully cool heads and wisdom will prevail, and a just solution worked out.
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Posted By: Tiny Flowers
Date Posted: 09 November 2014 at 2:11pm
Mihs............ this book might help to shed a better light on these issues inshallah
Gender Equity in Islam by Dr. Jamal Badawi
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Posted By: Tiny Flowers
Date Posted: 09 November 2014 at 2:17pm
By the way.... there are many new Fatwas out there these days ... that go along with the times we are living...
I have heard the ones about:
- of course no problem in traveling by plane
- if a lady has to work... then she has to work...
- etc.
islam tries to protect women... yes... but there are many situations when new fatwas are given .. to keep up with the times.... that is the purpose of ijtihad/ fatwas... (by proper scholars)....
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Posted By: Mihs
Date Posted: 20 November 2014 at 12:08am
Thank you Tiny flowers .. I ll sure read the book IA..
Are there really such fatwas.. I have never heard abt them...?
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