The beauty of Jerusalem is that it belongs to all the faithful because The Lord declared it and it's surroundings as holy. The only way is peace, and peace can only exist when it is made through Him. Especially in a place like Jerusalem, He is a jelous God as is said in the old testament so people should realize it is impossible to have true peace there aslong as they turn to others then Him(His laws and commands also) for a sollution(peace).

kenski70 wrote: To Christians and Jews Jerusalem is the equivalent of Mecca.

Just curious to know how does Jerusalam is holy to my Christian brothers as Mecca is to Muslims? I mean, Mecca is holy to Muslims through multiple ways. Which way is this analogy for my Christian brothers?

to me what matters is the people who can share the place. And yes war is part our humanity still. Had not The Lord checked one people with the other the corruption would have spoiled the earth and no churches synagogs or mosques would have remained standing.

It would definitely be interesting to know the response from my Christian brothers.

 Secondly, sharing is not what is called Justice. However, it is totally a different thing when it comes to ground realities, though, they are changed through forcefull means over the passage of time. It is exactly through this means that Israel is changing the ground realities, day by day, through persistant persecution of the habitants of the land. Nevertheless, its totally a different topic and don't want to divert from the main issue.

Just curious to know how does Jerusalem is holy to my Christian brothers as Mecca is to Muslims? I mean, Mecca is holy to Muslims through multiple ways. Which way is this analogy for my Christian brothers?

I guess a better way to put it is Jerusalem is the holiest city for Christians and Jews. Mecca is the holiest for Muslims. lets say someone told both of us as equals to write down the holiest city in their faith. Our answers may be different. Does that mean wrong? No, it means that our individual faiths says "that one." Jerusalem compared to Mecca is comparing apples to oranges. But both are #1 answers depending on who you ask. Don't think those Jews in Israel don't consider the Wailing Wall special. To the point that they feel its more special than the Kaaba or the Cross. Because they do.

hey kenski70,

how do you feel about this, people who stand in the way of peace should be removed from the way.

AhmadJoyia wrote: Oh ok, I see what you mean. In this sense then my question is more of as "how" in contrast to "why", is Jerusalam holy to Christians? I mean through which way this city becomes holy to Christians? Was Jesus born in that city or was Jesus buried in that city or simply put; what is the basis for this holiness for my christian brothers?

Jerusalem is where the atonement and resurrection happened.  In Jerusalem, the Garden of Gethsame, Jesus took on the sins of the world.  And in Jerusalem, he died, was buried and resurrected.  These to a Christian are far more important than his miraculous birth.  This was the fulfilling of his destiny and promise. 

Now, I know Muslims do not believe Jesus was crucified, but we do, therefore, Jerusalem is the Holiest City in Christendom. 

The Resurrection to Christians is the pinnacle of Holy events.  The Miracle we look to in our daily life.  In this way, Jerusalem is to us as Mecca is to a Muslim.  In Mecca, Gabrielle revealed the Quran to Mohammed.  This is the miracle that every muslim man and woman are defined by in their daily lives. 

The Kaabah, the site built by Ibrahim and his son, that would be a common point for all peoples of the Book, making Mecca Holy to all.

And since Jerusalem is the sight of the Temple, the Resurrection and the Prophet Mohammed's vision of heaven, it too is Holy to all.

In the end, we need to shed our concept that these cities belong to anyone but God.  I find it funny that immediately prior to the creation of Israel, all pilgrims were welcomed there, now we must fear traveling to our churches, synagogues and mosques. 

May God grant us peace in our hearts and love for our fellow man.

Community wrote: correction, those who block the way to peace should be removed from the way.

I got a better idea... why don't we just ignore them and walk around them.  They'll follow when God wills it.

Angela,

Great answer btw,

Jerusalem is where the atonement and resurrection happened.  In Jerusalem, the Garden of Gethsame, Jesus took on the sins of the world.  And in Jerusalem, he died, was buried and resurrected.

Thanks sis Angela for your reply. However, I am little surprised from your reply. Usually a place is made holy if there is any material or spiritual thing is attached to it. Since Jesus was raised within his material body, is any thing we call him "buried"? I think, you would also agree with me that he is not buried in any grave in Jerusalam at all. Isn't it? So, what's holiness of an empty land? Secondly, if only the miracles are the criteria for such a holiness, then what Jerusalam has any exception over the Virgin birth place of Jesus and his mother. Thirdly, you say 

These to a Christian are far more important than his miraculous birth.

This was the fulfilling of his destiny and promise

"³⁷He took Peter and the two sons of Zebedee along with him, and he began to be sorrowful and troubled. ³⁸Then he said to them, "My soul is overwhelmed with sorrow to the point of death. Stay here and keep watch with me."

 ³⁹Going a little farther, he fell with his face to the ground and prayed, "My Father, if it is possible, may this cup be taken from me. Yet not as I will, but as you will."

 ⁴⁰Then he returned to his disciples and found them sleeping. "Could you men not keep watch with me for one hour?" he asked Peter. ⁴¹"Watch and pray so that you will not fall into temptation. The spirit is willing, but the body is weak."

 ⁴²He went away a second time and prayed, "My Father, if it is not possible for this cup to be taken away unless I drink it, may your will be done."

With all this narration mentioned in the Bible, it would be surprising if anyone want to celebrate the occassion rather than mourn over it. Or otherwise, the Bible is to be challenged for its accuracy. Isn't it? 

Since Jesus was raised within his material body, is any thing we call him "buried"?

It is holy because of the events that happened there: he was crucified, died, was buried, and resurrected, all in Jerusalem.  We do not say "he is buried" in Jerusalem, be cause he raised from the dead and then ascended into heaven and is seated at the right hand of the father.  But he indeed was buried there at one time.  Those are all "spiritual" things as you call them, that happened there and that is why it is holy to us.

It is a common misconception by non-believers that Christmas is more important than Easter, but I can assure you that Christians know the difference. 

Luke:

Luke

44
        He said to them, "These are my words that I spoke to you while I was still with you, that everything written about me in the law of Moses and in the prophets and psalms must be fulfilled."

The so called Masjid Al Aqsa is not glued in my mind. I have never been there, my parents never visited the place nor my grandparent or any family members or neighbours. Beside I don't have a plan to visit it, it is not in our minds. My oldest brother mentioned about it once but that's long time ago.

The way the non muslims treated the respected city such as this has create the feeling of apathy among the muslims toward Jerussalem. Sure great - in the end the jews can cry on the wall day in day out, without the muslims Jerussalem will be just a city.

Sure there will few thousand christian pilgrims from overseas visiting the place and making note here and there. Man, without Islam the whole religions as we know it today were dead long ago. Islam is the driving force of the world spiritual life today. Your active life in christianity is because you see an active spiritual community in different part of the world who is not declining, and that is th reason of your activity.

Imagine if there is no Islam by now, what are you going to do?

Mekkah is a barren place, a very dear place for the muslims - and there is no need for the non muslims to support it. The muslims are the community that make Mekkah very special. The muslims are the people that make Jerussalem special. 

Without us Mekkah is just a barren uninteresting place. But Allah decreed it to be interesting place, and it is interesting.

But His command, when He intendeth a thing, is only that He saith unto it: Be! and it is. (36:82)

Jerussalem is spiritually dying yet the people just don't get it. But some mothers do have them, not all though.

It is up to the people like you ken, do you want to make the speedy death for it? Your call, we are losing interest to it.

Tell this to that preachers in America that their hey day to make daily hymn with flowing tears unhindered by the muslim is coming. Jerussalem is theirs, the dome of rock dismantled, the dopamine is rushing through the vein, the victory is completed.

Can you imagine the feeling kensky, just like the gladiator who has just won the battle in the arena and the roman crowd is cheering: we who are about to die salute you.

freebird wrote: Sure there will few thousand christian pilgrims from overseas visiting the place and making note here and there. Man, without Islam the whole religions as we know it today were dead long ago. Islam is the driving force of the world spiritual life today. Your active life in christianity is because you see an active spiritual community in different part of the world who is not declining, and that is th reason of your activity.

Where on earth do you get that from ?

Mekkah is a barren place, a very dear place for the muslims - and there is no need for the non muslims to support it. The muslims are the community that make Mekkah very special.

Mecca maybe a barren place, like many in the ME, But the Kabaa is there, and the most holist place for muslims, and of course there are other reasons why mecca is special to muslims, not just because of community. 

The muslims are the people that make Jerussalem special.

I'm sorry but that is a whole lot of bull.

There are many reasons why Jerusalem is special and muslims are a part of that too.

Sounds like you just want to be greedy and have ALL to yourself.  

Jerussalem is spiritually dying yet the people just don't get it. But some mothers do have them, not all though. It is up to the people like you ken, do you want to make the speedy death for it? Your call, we are losing interest to it.

Again, just b/s

Andrea, thanks.  I was on my way here this morning to explain the WAS buried, vs IS buried. 

I think it was an excellent answer.

Thanks sis Andrea for clearing many of the things. However, continuing on the same sub-topic, especially once you say "Those are all "spiritual" things as you call them, that happened there and that is why it is holy to us." You happened to forget that such spiritual things are not unique to Jerusalam, but to every where, where ever Jesus went to preach. Isn't it? It is difficult to understand as how one spiritual thing is more or less important than the other. I can quote, and probably you would agree with me, that there are many significant spiritual attachments of Jesus at places other than Jerusalam as well. The only way this last hour spirituality overrides all other occassions is understood to make sense when it is made to realize that some how Jesus changed his mind in this last hour than from rest of his whole life mission. Is this what you are telling us? Think about it? In my humble view, the correct position for my Christian brothers over Jerusalam should be that since Jesus was the continuation of Prophets sent to people of the Isreal, hence all such places which were holy prior to him, thus become holy to people beleiving in him. This is more in line with the Bible, which also tells us that he went to the synogogues in Jerusalam and tried to make the place holy from many mal-practices that had been developed over that place by the Jews. It is this picture, from the physical Jesus preaching in Jerusalm, and his view of attention that he focused on Jerusalam, that makes it holy for our Christian brothers, and no other things which remained "spiritual". Simply put, the emphasis by physical Jesus is of more significance, because of its uniqueness, than from "spiritual" stance, which is not unique.

On the other hand, according to my own understanding, Muslim don't have any thing special about Jerusalam. The famous and most revered mosque in Jerusalam was built by 2nd Caliph, Hz Umar, long time after the death of Prophet Mohammad. It is in this sense, that the significane of this mosque is not better nor less than any other mosque built on the face of this earth after Prophet Mohammad, other than its historical significance for the Muslims. Yes, they do try to bring spirituality concept for their claim of share on that land from the famous visit of Prophet Mohammad to heavens. But one must realise that never ever in his whole life, not in Quran nor that I have come across any hadith (at least not to my knowledge), there is any thing like making it obligatory for Muslim to occupy that place for such a  visit by Prophet Mohammad. Mentioning of that place as holy in the Quran, doesn't give any legitimate reason for Muslims to strive for it. However, its totally another thing to drive the people out of that place on the plea of holiness for any particular religion. Those who have been living there in Jerusalam, or for that matter anywhere on this earth, since centuries, as a basic human right, has the right to stay there and even have the right to fight legally for their right of self defence against all atrocities of the aggressors to occupy their land on such flimsy pretexts of holiness. Yes, for those who consider it any religious attachement to any place, they can purchase the land and live in that area, but they don't have any right to bar others not to do the same.    

You happened to forget that such spiritual things are not unique to Jerusalam, but to every where, where ever Jesus went to preach. Isn't it? It is difficult to understand as how one spiritual thing is more or less important than the other. I can quote, and probably you would agree with me, that there are many significant spiritual attachments of Jesus at places other than Jerusalam as well. The only way this last hour spirituality overrides all other occassions is understood to make sense when it is made to realize that some how Jesus changed his mind in this last hour than from rest of his whole life mission. Is this what you are telling us? Think about it? In my humble view, the correct position for my Christian brothers over Jerusalam should be that since Jesus was the continuation of Prophets sent to people of the Isreal, hence all such places which were holy prior to him, thus become holy to people beleiving in him.

Brother, there are many places that are Holy to Christians.  The location of the Sermon on the Mount, the site of his first Miracle, Bethlehem, Egypt.  But, in Jerusalem, he sealed his new covenant and triumphed over death.  This is greater than any sermon or healing.  This was for the entire world.  The Atonement and Resurrection are leaps and bounds ahead of turning water to wine or casting out devils from Mary Magdeline.  I suppose since you only see Jesus as a Prophet and you do not believe in these events, you cannot understand how they speak to the heart of a Christian.  The days between Palm Sunday and Easter are so sacred to all Christians, its hard to express that to anyone who doesn't believe.

And as for Jesus's doubts.  Now, remembering I'm LDS and so I can't speak for other denominations on this one.  We believe that our souls existed before creation.  When we are born here, a veil is pulled over our eyes so we cannot remember our lives with God.  This is so we can be tested.  We believe in order to progress eternally, we must go through certain trials.  Jesus in this respect was no different.  He to had to be tested.  We cannot even imagine what he went through in the Garden.  It said he bleed from every pour.  So, how can we question if he had a moment in failing?  Would I have been any stronger?  No, not even close.  But, in the end, doubt or not, he went forth and prayed for those that killed him.  "Father, they know not what they do." 

And yet, in that last moment, he failed not, instead he submitted himself to God entirely.

Luke 23:46

And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.

And as for Muslims not finding anything special about Jerusalem?  This statement confuses me totally given the last 1400 years in that region?

Those who have been living there in Jerusalam, or for that matter anywhere on this earth, since centuries, as a basic human right, has the right to stay there and even have the right to fight legally for their right of self defence against all atrocities of the aggressors to occupy their land on such flimsy pretexts of holiness. Yes, for those who consider it any religious attachement to any place, they can purchase the land and live in that area, but they don't have any right to bar others not to do the same.    

And to that I say, Amen!!  I agree wholeheartedly with you on that.  I think it is rude to come into someone's home bearing arms and kicking them out of it.  Not only is it rude, but it is also primitive and barbaric.  That is why we have an economic system and laws that allow for the sale of land, the issuing of Visas to visit countries, and fast airplanes to to visit them any time one wishes. 

However you and I know very well that the issue goes much deeper than that.  It originates since thousand's of years and the arrogance of the Jews in this case has made it impossible to have peace in this area.  Sure Jerusalem is holy to Christians, and at one time we did try to occupy Jerusalem, but honestly, I don't see Christians today claiming physical ownership of it.  We claim it in our hearts maybe, but I don't see a multitude of Christians trying to drive out both Jews and Muslims so that we have it all to ourselves.  The conflict here is between Jews and Muslims.  And in my humble opinion, I think it's the Jews who have not been able to "share" the place.  They haven't been "playing nice". 

So going back to your question:

It is difficult to understand as how one spiritual thing is more or less important than the other.

Well my friend, in order to understand this you would have to understand how our faith works.  But there is one part in the bible that says that if you don't believe that Jesus died on the cross for our sins, then your whole faith is for nothing.  This means that you could believe everything else, but if you don't believe this one little part then you've missed the whole point, and his sacrifice was lost on you.  Kind of like hearing a joke but missing the punch line!!  You don't get to laugh!!

Peace.

The land was holy before the birth of Jesus, and before the last prophet made the night journey to it. The holy land is right in the middle, between Europe, Asia and Africa, travelers from the west who went eastwards met there with travelers from the east who taveled westward. And those who found eachother chose to live there in peace. If you mix African with European and Asian you will get a person that is semetic. And out of this mixed people Allah chose His chosen people for messengers and prophets to declare that He is One God and He is the only one to be served. He chose them upon a knowledge He says in the koran.

Jerusalem "the house of peace" why would The Lord not declare it holy when it was the first place on earth where different people met and chose to live together in peace? Jerusalem.

For those who wish to learn something new and reflect, In arabic "Jaar" means "neighbour" so Jarusalem would mean "the neighbour" of peace.

I got your point, Bro Whisper, though the originator of this topic is one such example.

Sis Angela, thanks for your further elaboration. Though out of the scope of this topic, but I can't go without asking as what do you mean by "But, in Jerusalem, he sealed his new covenant and triumphed over death. " Which new covenant are you talking about, especially once we read from Bible that Jesus came not to change but to fulfill the law. Therefore bringing new covenant in picture, is as what I said, changing mind in the last hour. I didn't see the answer to this question of mine, in your reply.

The second point here as you said, is "triumphed over death". How is this achieved uniquely, which no other could do? I mean, in his life time, Jesus used to raise the dead to life by his God's permission.

Then what is big deal as what you think that he rose from dead. Don't you think God could do the same for him as well? Even this raising of dead is not unique to Jesus only, where OT also mentions some incidences of Prophets doing the same miracle. But all, through the will of God only.

On the more, which day is the day of Easter celebrations? The Friday (when supposedly the Christ was crucified) or Sunday (when he was resurrected alive)? It is really hard, for a person like me, to understand the celebrations of one day over the other, though only my Christian bro/sis may make this understand. Or, may be whole of the weekend, from Friday to Sunday is the celebrations. Yes, on a shorter note, who else would have joined you in these days of celebrations other than those Jews who conspired against Jesus as well? Just think about it. This shall be even more interesting to know, than imagined.

In the end, I can't leave my post without discussing when you say " Jesus in this respect was no different.  He to had to be tested.". Isn't this purely a human phenomena, totally in contrast to any divinity associated with him?

"This statement confuses me totally given the last 1400 years in that region?" Though you are not alone, but the presented discussion needs logical refutation and not the emotional one. I am anxiously waiting for such a response from any religious quarters. 

Thanks sis Andrea for sharing your comments.

I am anxiously looking forward to the reference from the Bible when you say "But there is one part in the bible that says that if you don't believe that Jesus died on the cross for our sins, then your whole faith is for nothing."

On the more, this picture is totally opposite (180 degree) when we see in the same bible (Matthew narration), how Jesus was preparing to avert this last hour situation. He was preparing with his materialistic (disciples to watch) as well as spiritualistic (prayers to God) means to avoid this. Kindly refer back to my posting on the 2nd page where this whole incidence is quoted.

If it is true as you ask us to beleive, why would he be so defensive or in other words reluctant to go for scrafice. It seems that he wasn't prepared for it as he his prayer to God clearly shows. On the same note, kindly note as what Bible records his last few words on the cross before crucifiction. Here it is "⁴⁶About the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi,^[a] lama sabachthani?"�which means, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"^["