salam,

I have been married for 1 year 4 months,  and was seperated  for 1 week, recently (we have been back together for 2 weeks. now) I just found out I was pregnant it's 2-3 weeks, we are not a stable relationship we both are not happy, and thought we would give the realtionship one last try..............and now this. normally this would be a blessing but in this case I hate it, think it is only going to cause more problems.  When is a abortion o.k?  how soon can one be done with out taking a soul?

need some advice,

thank you

Leen,

Have you thought about adoption?  I personally suffer from infertility and though the child would be a burden on you and your spouse.  There are thousands of couples like my husband and I who would jump at the chance to raise the child.  I mean to be gentle in saying that life has already begun and abortion is really a hard subject for a number of people.  I understand cases of incest, rape and when the mother and infant will die.  But, if you cannot raise the child.  Please consider letting a woman who cannot have her own give your baby a loving home. 

Also, if you are worried about financial stress.  There are programs like Baby Your Baby and the Healthy Baby Initiative that can help you get Doctor's appointments and get help from places like WIC.  That's if you're in the United States.

There are other options.  Family adoption is another one.  Sisters, Cousins, etc. 

Pray to God for Guidance and see what you feel in your heart. 

Auzubillahi minash shaitan ir rajeem,

Buismillah ir rahman ir rahim,

Assalamualaikum Leen,

Congratulations on your pregnancy!

I am sorry to hear about your unstable relationship. May you be able to work it out with your husband, thru wisdom and understanding, insha allah.

Though abortion is permited under certain circumstances - ie when the mother's life is in danger, it should not be in your case. Better if you consult a scholar.

As to the second part of your question, one can abort the foetus before 3 months of gestation.

This is not to undermine Angela's beautiful proposal, but it would be better for both you and your husband to reconsider. Many times relationships get a new perspective with a new arrival

All the best!

Maa salaama,

Nausheen

My proposal was only to offer options if they cannot handle the baby Nausheen.

My fear is women too often think abortion is a quick and easy answer.  People never discuss the other options, especially here in the US for fear of "offending" someone who is Pro-Choice. 

They forget part of being Pro Choice is choosing to NOT have the abortion and so they fail to discuss what to do if you can't go through with it.

I hope the months of the pregnancy bring stability to the couple.

To quote a friend, since I do not have one of my own.  She says, "You never love your husband more than the day they put your child in your arms for the first time and you look into his face and see your husband's eyes."

You are not allowed an abortion if its not threatening your life. Besides - i can only put this in one way - if you were unhappy - i would have thought contraception would have been a better preventative than considering abortion as a cure.

Its now your responsibility. I have no sympathy for you. Its something you should have thought through before.Sorry if i sound harsh.

Muslim Friend wrote: You are not allowed an abortion if its not threatening your life. Besides - i can only put this in one way - if you were unhappy - i would have thought contraception would have been a better preventative than considering abortion as a cure.   Its now your responsibility. I have no sympathy for you. Its something you should have thought through before.Sorry if i sound harsh.

Despite our differences, I liked your post the most in this thread. You will surely be/are a good mother.

You both maybe unstable when together, but when alone you are probably stable and I think that should count, and I don't think there is a need to get an abortion because both parties can't work things out.

You do not need two parents to bring up a child, altough it can help but its not necessary, I am from a single parent family and my mum did everything without a man around and I am quite perfectly fine  and of course there will be hardships but if you have family and friends, then it lessens it.  

Muslim Friend wrote: Its now your responsibiity. I have no sympathy for you. Its something you should have thought through before.Sorry if i sound harsh.

You should have sympathy.  She shouldn't have an abortion, but this young woman is in need of caring hearts and encouragement.  Where is your charitable spirit?  Instead of chastising her about her being with her husband, you should be helping her by encouraging her to be a good mother and wife.  Or at the very least to give the child life and a good home. 

I surely hope when it is you who are struggling with an unexpected occurance and turn for help there are more charitable and kind people to put a hand out to you.

I surely hope when it is you who are struggling with an unexpected occurance and turn for help there are more charitable and kind people to put a hand out to you.

Angela - i have been through this very situation - i am a single parent - but not for 1sec did i even contemplate an abortion. If this girl knew that her relationship was more than unlikely to last and they were already going through a small separtion - then do you not think that bringing a child into the world should be considered once you are comfortable in your relationship and know you can provide that child with a stable household??

What i meant and probably should have made more clear is - that i have no sympathy for someone who at the first hurdle considers a way out - But if she tried i bet she would make a great parent - it'll be hard but as long as you have a support system you'll be fine.

Auzubillahi minash shaitan ir rajeem,

Bismillah ir rahman ir rahim,

We are all different individiuals with different situations and potentials. 

Dear Muslim friend, we all go thru hardships in our lives, and face them in whatever way we are able to. When we see our fellow humans in a similar condition it should call for compassion and kindness extended from us.

Alhamdulillah, you had the wisdom and far sightedness to handle your situation more tactfully, which this sister is unable to. But we do not know pressures which she may be going thru.

when we do not know the reasons for a person's drawbacks, it is better not to convey our readings on them that may hurt.

Maa salaama,

Nausheen

I disagree with whatever scholar said that abortion is permitted until 3 months. Life is present at conception and as Muslims we must protect innocent human life and the virtue of our lives as servants of God. I urge all sisters on this thread to stand up against abortion in all circumstances pertaining to "choice".  We are called to support the mother who suffers from a harsh situation and if necessary raise a child who is orphaned or adopted out (which is understandable in case of rape or incest) And those women who choose life in these excrutiating circumstances are todays unsung heros! Unmarried pregnant women find themselves in an irreversable situation which ultimately has no solution that feels ideal. The result of her "mistake" becomes her redeeming solution by adopting this child to a loving family with a mother and a father. These women are fulfilling their obligation of pregnancy by protecting the child in their womb and gaining alot of dawah for labor! Humbling themselves and accepting charity of a more stable family they choose the best life for the baby in hopes of a better future for others.

Peace

MayPB,

I couldn't say it better myself.  To bring the child into the world is a great duty given to us by God.  Its a sacred duty that belongs to women, and its one of the many things that Satan attacks to weaken the family and the spirits of people. 

I hope Leen, that you and your husband find peace before this child is born.  Perhaps the baby will give you both focus.  Just remember, there are options.

Recently My grandmother came to me to adopt a child to her sister's granddaughter.  The situation was not ideal for them either, but Brit has decided to keep her child and struggle through it.  I am very happy for them, but they know if it gets too much.  My home is open.  I hope like them, you and yours can find a way.

Bismillah,

Dear Sister Leen,

There are a lot of important points and valuable information people have brought up and quoted for you and provided links.  There are a few things you need to consider personally:  How would you feel about yourself the week after, the month after, the year after, ten years after, if you have an abortion, or if you keep the child?  Abortion is physically and emotionally painful for many women.  The scars from that may hurt your life more than help it.  However, the truth is that some women can handle it.  And I don't know anything about those who have no trouble with having abortions.

I think abortion is a terrible birth control method and is a very evil way of oppressing women.  But Muslims disagree on this.  Some people have stated that it is clearly forbidden, but I know that I have read different points of view from different madhabs and others. 

My personal advice is not to do it.  The life you have been given is a beautiful gift, not a burden.  Please contact me and others here for support whatever you decide. 

Herjihad,

It seems easy enough put like that "whatever you decide", this is not a whatever situation.

Auzubillahi minash shaitan ir rajeem,

Bismillah ir rahman ir rahim,

MayPB wrote: I disagree with whatever scholar said that abortion is permitted until 3 months. Life is present at conception and as Muslims we must protect innocent human life and the virtue of our lives as servants of God.

There isn't an unconditional okay for abortion within three months of gestation. Islam definetily protects human life, that  is why if a pregnant mother is at risk of her life, she has permission to abort the foetus - ie in a situation where either of the two lives is in danger, Islam is to protect that of the mother.  If the mother is at risk, it could possibly endanger the life of the foetus as well, to avoid all this, a mother is allowed to abort it, and wisely so.

Not denying the fact that life begins from the very moment of conception the "ruh" or the soul is sent down into it after three months. It is after this event that abortion is forbidden.

Maa salaama,

Nausheen 

Nausheen,

I did not use this scenario as  that abortion would be allowed

because it is so rare. Before abortions were legal in the United States 

a woman could have a legal abortion if her life was in danger. What

positive action has been acheived by pointing out when a child has a

soul? If we are pregnant we know we carry a baby, end of story. If

people argue about when this child is really a child and not merely a

"blood clot" or "bunch of cells" then we won't value the individual

rights of that unborn baby. 

MayPB

http://www.babycenter.com/pregnancy/fetaldevelopment/index - http://www.babycenter.com/pregnancy/fetaldevelopment/index

The baby is moving, with a beating heart by 7 weeks, two months...I hardly think the soul is absent until 3 months. 

The soul is a very part of creation itself. 

Bismillah,

Angela, the Holy Quran tells us that the soul is placed into the body at three months.  The body is a vessel for the soul to enter until then.

May, there are many different viewpoints that I have read of scholars opinions on this subject.  I have my viewpoint and I expressed it. 

 It is important to me to let this Muslimah know that we are here for her whatver action she and her husband decide on.  The reality is that neither you nor I can stop them from their decision.  We can encourage them to preserve this wonderful gift of Allah, SWT, and to look at it as such. 

Life is a miracle.  We look for miracles in our lives.  How could we destroy a miracle purposefully?

What verse exactly, to look it up -

thanks,

May

Bismillah,

I did a search online.  Here are some relevant passages about fetal development.  However, I did not find the quote for the fact that Allah, SWT, puts our souls in the bodies of our mothers at three months of embryonic development.  These are all the results from a search for the word "clot".

If someone else knows where this is, please post it.

Bi ismillahir rahmanir raheem regarding the issue of 120 days, that according to Shari�ah the soul (Ruh) enters the foetus at 120 days (4 months) from conception. The Jurists (Fuqaha) have based this duration upon a Qur�anic verse and a statement of the beloved of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace). In the verse Allah states the stages of development of the embryo in the womb of the mother. Allah Almighty says: �And verily we did create man from a quintessence (of clay). Then we placed him (as a drop of sperm) in a place of rest, firmly fixed. Then we made the sperm into a clot of congealed blood. Then of that clot we made a (foetus) lump. Then we made out of that lump bones and clothed the bones with flesh. Then we developed out of it another creature (by breathing life into it). So blessed be Allah, the most marvellous creator� (Surah al-Mu�minun, 12/13/14). In the Hadith recorded by the two most authentic authorities, Imam al-Bukhari and Imam Muslim in their respective Sahih collections, the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) discussed in detail the periods elapsing between these stages, mentioned by the Qur�an. Abdullah ibn Mas�ud (Allah be pleased with him) narrates that the Messenger of Allah (Allah bless him & give him peace) said: �The seed of one of you remains in the womb of the mother for forty days in the form of a Nutfa (sperm). Then it remains like a clot for another forty days, and then for a same number of days like a lump of flesh (when the formation of the limbs and the growth of the bones begin) (Sahih al-Bukhari & Sahih Muslim). The great Hanafi Faqeeh Ibn Abidin States in his Radd al-Muhtar: �The soul enters the foutus at one hundred & twenty days (4 months), as established by the Hadith� (Radd al-Muhtar, 1/202) The ruling on abortion in stage (a) i.e. after the entry of the soul into the foetus which is (as explained) 120 days, is that, it is totally impermissible and tantamount to murder, as it results in the taking out of an innocent life. All the scholars have unanimously condemned such a ghastly act. regarding the issue of abortion prior to 120 days, With regards to stage (b) i.e. prior to the entry of the soul into the foetus (120 days), the ruling is that, even in this case it is unlawful (Haram) to abort the pregnancy. The reason why abortion prior to the soul entering the body will not be permitted is that, although there may not be life in the foetus, but the foetus is considered to be part and parcel of the mother�s body as long as it remains in the womb. Thus, just as one�s very own life and also all the limbs and organs of the human body are trust given by the Almighty Creator, so too is the foetus also a trust given to the mother by Allah, and she will not have a right to abort it. The only difference here is that the sin of aborting the foetus will be of a lesser degree then aborting it after 120 days. It would not be regarded as murder, rather violating the rights of a human organ entrusted to the mother by Allah Almighty. see the raminder of the fatwah for more detail. ------------- Rasul Allah (sallah llahu alaihi wa sallam) said: "Whoever knows himself, knows his Lord" and whoever knows his Lord has been given His gnosis and nearness.

Bi ismillahir rahmanir raheem thank you to the person who informed you they saved me an argument regarding who to follow? this is a rough break down of the muslim world, Sunni muslims comprise roughly 90% of all muslims, the other major group is Shia they are roughly 5% probably more but not by much. The overwhelming majority of muslims follow one of four schools of thought, Egypt and Asian Onciania countries are Shafii, North Africans are Maliki, Turkey and some Middle eastern countries are Hanafi while other middle eastern countries are hanbali. out of these four the  Major madhabs are the Hanafi and Shafii in terms of population. Western Muslims are comprised of fragmented groups which is why you dont see them even knowing what a madhhab is, the only other exception is Saudi arabia which is wahhabi they also have big influence with western muslims. If you Quote any ruling which is from any madhhab it would be accptable for any muslim to follow even if it is the opposite of what i mentioned, this is how muslims treat diferences of opinion as long as the opinion is from an expert and not an unqualified person or sect. otherwise if the person follows Saudi you Quote for them from there scholars, generaly speaking people who adhere to the madhhabs do not accept rulings from them, i dont think they have a diferent opinion on this matter though allahu alam. I was Quoting the Hanafi madhhab as the Fatwah stated, i was under the asumption you had read the legal rulling but insha allah i will consider your sugestion in the future. If you do the math on the sections i quoted you will arrive at 120 days, although i should state hadith are not legal rullings so even if i quote a few ahadith or versus from the Quran it would be impermisable to take them as fatwah. Far to many issues exist which must be sorted out beffore we ensure that what we are Quoting is not abrogated or conditional or only part of the picture i could give you examples of how easy it is to confuse and misguide your self by taking a hadith as your fatwah the matter needs to be investigated and the utmost care taken. ------------- Rasul Allah (sallah llahu alaihi wa sallam) said: "Whoever knows himself, knows his Lord" and whoever knows his Lord has been given His gnosis and nearness.

Auzubillahi minash shaitan ir rajeem, Bismillah ir rahman ir rahim, Angela wrote: Sorry Herjihad, Rami But I have yet to see the verse in the Quran that says we don't get our souls until three months? Where is the verse? Angela, The Quran is sometimes silent on certain specifics, which are detailed in the hadith literature. If I am not wrong the following verses are closest to your querry: 032.007 YUSUFALI: He Who has made everything which He has created most good: He began the creation of man with (nothing more than) clay, PICKTHAL: Who made all things good which He created, and He began the creation of man from clay; SHAKIR: Who made good everything that He has created, and He began the creation of man from dust. 032.008 YUSUFALI: And made his progeny from a quintessence of the nature of a fluid despised: PICKTHAL: Then He made his seed from a draught of despised fluid; SHAKIR: Then He made his progeny of an extract, of water held in light estimation. 032.009 YUSUFALI: But He fashioned him in due proportion, and breathed into him something of His spirit. And He gave you (the faculties of) hearing and sight and feeling (and understanding): little thanks do ye give! PICKTHAL: Then He fashioned him and breathed into him of His Spirit; and appointed for you hearing and sight and hearts. Small thanks give ye! SHAKIR: Then He made him complete and breathed into him of His spirit, and made for you the ears and the eyes and the hearts; little is it that you give thanks. Thru the hadith we get a closer picture of the events that follow in succession in a mother's womb. The following are from Al-Bukhari Narrated 'Abdullah bin Mas'ud Allah's Apostle the true and truly inspired, narrated to us, "The creation of everyone of you starts with the process of collecting the material for his body within forty days and forty nights in the womb of his mother. Then he becomes a clot of thick blood for a similar period (40 days) and then he becomes like a piece of flesh for a similar period. Then an angel is sent to him (by Allah) and the angel is allowed (ordered) to write four things; his livelihood, his (date of) death, his deeds, and whether he will be a wretched one or a blessed one (in the Hereafter) and then the soul is breathed into him.So one of you may do (good) deeds characteristic of the people of Paradise so much that there is nothing except a cubit between him and Paradise but then what has been written for him decides his behavior and he starts doing (evil) deeds characteristic of the people of Hell (Fire) and (ultimately) enters Hell (Fire); and one of you may do (evil) deeds characteristic of the people of Hell (Fire) so much so that there is nothing except a cubit between him and Hell (Fire), thenwhat has been written for him decides his behavior and he starts doing(good) deeds characteristic of the people of Paradise and ultimately) enters Paradise." Narrated 'Abdullah Allah's Apostle, the truthful and truly-inspired, said, "Each one of you collected in the womb of his mother for forty days, and then turnsinto a clot for an equal period (of forty days) and turns into a piece of flesh for a similar period (of forty days) and then Allah sends an angel and orders him to write four things, i.e., his provision, his age, and whether he will be of the wretched or the blessed (in the Hereafter). Then the soul is breathed into him. And by Allah, a personamong you (or a man) may do deeds of the people of the Fire till thereis only a cubit or an arm-breadth distance between him and the Fire, but then that writing (which Allah has ordered the angel to write) precedes, and he does the deeds of the people of Paradise and enters it; and a man may do the deeds of the people of Paradise till there isonly a cubit or two between him and Paradise, and then that writing precedes and he does the deeds of the people of the Fire and enters it." Narrated Abdullah Allah's Apostle, the true and truly inspired said, "(as regards your creation), every one of you is collected in the womb of his mother forthe first forty days, and then he becomes a clot for an other forty days, and then a piece of flesh for an other forty days. Then Allah sends an angel to write four words: He writes his deeds, time of his death, means of his livelihood, and whether he will be wretched or blessed (in religion). Then the soul is breathed into his body. So a man may do deeds characteristic of the people of the (Hell) Fire, so much so that there is only the distance of a cubit between him and it,and then what has been written (by the angel) surpasses, and so he starts doing deeds characteristic of the people of Paradise and entersParadise. Similarly, a person may do deeds characteristic of the people of Paradise, so much so that there is only the distance of a cubit between him and it, and then what has been written (by the angel) surpasses, and he starts doing deeds of the people of the (Hell) Fire and enters the (Hell) Fire.  Narrated 'Abdullah bin Mus'ud Allah's Apostle, the true and truly inspired said, "(The matter of theCreation of) a human being is put together in the womb of the mother in forty days, and then he becomes a clot of thick blood for a similar period, and then a piece of flesh for a similar period. Then Allah sends an angel who is ordered to write four things. He is ordered to write down his (i.e. the new creature's) deeds, his livelihood, his (date of) death, and whether he will be blessed or wretched (in religion). Then the soul is breathed into him. So, a man amongst you may do (good deeds till there is only a cubit between him and Paradise and then what has been written for him decides his behavior and he starts doing (evil) deeds characteristic of the people of the (Hell) Fire. And similarly a man amongst you may do (evil) deeds till there is only a cubit between him and the (Hell) Fire, and then what has been written for him decides his behavior, and he starts doing deeds characteristic of the people of Paradise." Every life is sacred in Islam, and even one taken away in injustice is like a murder of entire mankind. It is as straightforward as this. Abortion is not permissible for petty reasons like "I was not ready". it was an accident, we are not financially stable etc etc ... I have skimed thru your responses Angela, perhaps I should give more time, but so far I am unable to understand why you cannot see the regard for soul in Islam. Or why you had been re-emphasising your point when it was said already that aborting a pregnancy is wrong in Islam. Peace, Nausheen ------------- <font color=purple>Wanu nazzilu minal Qurani ma huwa Shafaa un wa rahmatun lil mo'mineena wa la yaziduzzalimeena illa khasara.[/COLOR]

Bi ismillahir rahmanir raheem Angela go back to my oroginal post and click on the Blue highlighted writting they are links to the original fatwah not simply writing which is highlighted in blue and underlined so it stands out May i dont know what you are talking about in America abortion is an option for women if they choose it, so for a muslim to follow what there religion says is well within American laws, please dont throw out there generalised statments espetialy regarding Islamic law when non muslims simply treat them  as they would any other law, they do not understand them and there nature so they have no right to comment on them in such a manner. If you are a muslims by some chance i sugest learning more about what shariah law is from reliable traditional sources, about how it is implamented in non muslim countries and what your responsibility is. just some advice only a muslim government has the right for punishment and only in there lands, so no choping of hands or stonning to death or what ever stereotyopical image you have of our faith, it is haram to take matters into your own hands. Can non muslims stop commenting on this topic your input is not asked for this isnt a discussion a muslim is asking for Islamic advice not confusion from your end. If you wish to discuss this by all means you are more than welcome to start a seperate topic in the relavent sections. This interferance is the main issue moderators have with non muslims, a muslim can not seek advice from another muslim without a non muslim confusing the issue, we dont mind simple questions to clarify a point but this is getting out of hand. The main reason for this site is to guide muslims then it is to educate non muslims please show some wisdom on the matter. i wont be around for 2 weeks so i wont be able to reply to anything being said. ------------- Rasul Allah (sallah llahu alaihi wa sallam) said: "Whoever knows himself, knows his Lord" and whoever knows his Lord has been given His gnosis and nearness.