Satan in the Quran?
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Category: Religion - Islam
Forum Name: Islam for non-Muslims
Forum Description: Non-Muslims can ask questions about Islam, discussion for the purpose of learning.
URL: https://www.islamicity.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=4550
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Topic: Satan in the Quran?
Posted By: Cicely
Subject: Satan in the Quran?
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 1:25pm
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Ok I really don't understand this...there are verses in the Quran that are attributed to Satan? How can one expect a non-muslim to believe in a book that includes satanic verses? Didn't Muhammad think that he was possesed by a demon when he was writing the Quran and not writing the words of God? This is very troubling to me, and makes me think that this alone strengthens my unbelief in Islam being the true path to God. If I am wrong, please correct me. Again I would like REFERENCE not sole opinion. I want clarity not a debate. thanks!
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Replies:
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 2:06pm
and what are those satanic verses? please quote them
If demon wrote Koran then why will it curse itself in the Koran ? Also before reciting the koran, we say:I seek refuge in Allah(God) from the rejected Satan |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 2:11pm
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Once again I would like references--I am a CHRISTIAN who only knows about Islam from various sources. I said that I didn't understand this allegation, and I needed help with it. I didnt know anything about it cursing itself or whatever. PLEASE re-read what I asked. Your rhetoric does not help me in my quest to find the answers. If I KNEW them I would quote them as you asked for me to do above. This is from what I have read from some other Muslims in another forum, but I must have misunderstood. |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 2:16pm
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what forum is it ?
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Posted By: Mishmish
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 2:17pm
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There are no Satanic verses in the Quran, nor did the Prophet Mohammed believe he was possessed by a demon during the relevation of the Quran by the angel Gabriel. It is rather hard to give you proof that what you are saying is untrue if you cannot give us the supposed materials that state this. The only way for you to know that the Quran does not contain these verses is to read it yourself unless you have something a bit more specific for us to go on. That would be like me saying that part of the Bible was written by Satan and glorifies him, but I don't know which part so prove to me it wasn't and doesn't. ------------- It is only with the heart that one can see clearly, what is essential is invisible to the eye. (The Little Prince) |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 2:22pm
| Ok I need to hear from a Muslim person who is familiar with the claims that have been made about Muhammad and the Quran. I do not know the verses because I have not read it. But I do know what I have heard and what was written in some historical info about Islam.. I will look up som more info and get back to you. |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 2:23pm
there are many anti islamic websites and forums. |
Posted By: Mishmish
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 2:27pm
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We would need the actual verse and number of the verse. The Quran is written much like the Bible, example: John 3:16.... So we would need to know this information in order to address these accusations. ------------- It is only with the heart that one can see clearly, what is essential is invisible to the eye. (The Little Prince) |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 2:50pm
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Does the Quran not say that Muhammad was a man who made mistakes, but Jesus lead a sinless life? If it does say that, then why would one be compelled to believe in the words of a sinful man more than the words of one who lived a blameless life? http://www.faithfreedom.org/Articles/sina10306.htm - |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 3:00pm
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Did the Qur�an at one point tell Muslims to worship al-Lat, al-Uzza and Manat? Yes. In Surah 53:19-20. Have those verses been �abrogated� out of the present Qur�an? Yes. What were they called? �The Satanic Verses.� source: Im not trying to insult anyone's faith. I just want to know how one would respond to this claim. |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 3:16pm
This is an anti-Islamic website. They twist Koran and mistranslate it, also take stuff out of context to justify their lies. |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 3:19pm
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ok... what about the verses they quoted? what do they actualy mean then?
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Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 3:29pm
This is from the link you posted
6 Did He not find you (O Muhammad (Peace be upon him)) an orphan and gave you a refuge? 7 And He found you unaware (of the Qur'�n, its legal laws, and Prophethood, etc.) and guided you? 8 And He found you poor, and made you rich (selfsufficient with selfcontentment, etc.)? 9 Therefore, treat not the orphan with oppression. This is what it means. |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 3:32pm
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Muhammed wanted to kill himself and thought he was going mad? this is according to exerpts from his biography. Just because this site is not by muslims does not mean its claims should be dismissed; rather, they should be addressed and clarified if they are incorrect or taken out of context. ************************ Cicely, ************The link from anti-Islam sources will be deleted as it goes against guidelines. You have to listen to what Muslims have to say here regarding Islam and Prophet Muhammad ( peace be upon him ) in order to clarify your doubts about Islam. --Peacemaker |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 3:48pm
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I just visited the website and read some stories of people leavin Islam. As one reads the ********, one will notice that the site often has testimonies and stories of Muslims leaving Islam. Nearly every week they have an update. However so, as I have read these testimonies they always seem hilariously funny, it is like watching a bad script, and a bad actor. Now I am not saying that all testimonies are false, but after a while you can tell the difference between real ones and fake ones. It will not take a genius to figure out that there have been several fake testimonies. I mean when you read these testimonies you will think to yourself, that if these people were really Muslims then they were the dumbest Muslims around! However so, I don�t believe that. These supposed testimonies show the same mind-set of a Christian, or an atheists perception of Islam, which is what makes these testimonies all the more funny. What makes this more amusing is that all of the readers on that silly site, including Ali Zina do not question any of those testimonies; they just post them without thinking if they are true or false. I mean I could go on a forum now, and make a fake testimony of me leaving Christianity! People can say all types of things on forums, and they do it a lot on that rubbish site. I will quote some parts of a few testimonies which will really show how fake they are. Testimony 1: Not until about two years ago I never doubted Islam as a true religion, and �Allah� is the almighty GOD, and Mohammed is the messenger of Allah to human kind. What else can I know, and I was born to a large family, uneducated parents, who blindly accept everything the �book� and the haddiths say. Note the propaganda already. This idiot is actually insulting this own parents!!! Note the message that this loser is trying to send, that Muslims are un-educated, follow everything blindly, who writes this stuff!!!! Yes, Muslims are so blind and stupid, yet this supposed former Muslim was so smart and was able to see the truth, hilarious. So basically the message is all Muslims are dumb, all who leave Islam are the smart ones and know what they are doing, the ones who stay Muslims are blind people. My suggestion to people who write this stuff is to make it a bit more real next time, I mean common, if you want to make something up, at least try to make it seem a bit realistic. Let us continue: I asked Allah to clear my heart, and make me a better Muslim, and to allow me to go straight into paradise, and please, please not to toss me into the hell fire. More and more propaganda rubbish. Here this faker is trying to send the message that all Muslims simply pray and try to be a good Muslim because we constantly fear being thrown into fire. That claim is un-true, yes all Muslims fear the hell-fire, but we do not go around praying and being a good Muslim because we are always constantly afraid of hell fire. So basically the faker is now trying to show that Muslims are blind people who practice Islam to simply avoid hell. Again, WHO WRITES THIS STUFF!!!!! I can tell you I follow Islam not because I constantly fear hell, but because I believe in Allah, the true God, and he commands me to, and I happily follow to please God, and that is the straight path. Continuing with this fake testimony: But the unexpected happed, after days and days of asking Allah his guidance continuously, every time I come to pray or read the Quran I felt sickened, irritated, annoyed. I felt sort of shaking sometimes and angry that I started cursing silently while I am supposed to be performing my prayers. Really? Well if this is true this shows that just like your mentor Ali Sina, you too suffer from mental illness and trouble. In fact what you were doing is the sign of someone who has a jinn with them, since the evil jinn hate the Quran, and when they are near it they curse, and do whatever they can to be insulting. Strange you seem to have these symptoms in you. Anyway this is getting funny now, but let us continue with it: I think that�s disgusting. I will never follow anyone, and only follow my heart, because it knows what is right for me. Really? What an arrogant fool. They follow their own desires, rather than follow the one who made them, oh well, I will just go and rob a bank. wait I will kill someone. Well that is the end of one testimony, as you can see, it does not take a brain genius to figure out the load of lies and rubbish and propaganda involved in these fake stories. I mean common, this was first posted on a forum! And everyone takes it as final and do not even question it. So if I go to a forum and say I saw a fish with 13 eyes, and it has 6 hands, and had a superman logo on its body, would those people on the forum believe me? ;) This just shows how weak and silly that site is, and shows how foolish their readers really are, they all take each other for lies to make each other feel good. Maybe they should have a contest on who can make up the best testimony. |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 3:53pm
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I agree with you ak_m_f. The "follow my heart" mess is very arrogant. I have told that same thing to people I know who believe that they can figure out life for themselves and god for themselves without any guidance from any type of scripture. What usually happens is that the person shapes his or her beliefs to what is "comfortable" for them and not to what God wants them to know. I want to apologize for the above site. I found it on google and I didnt read the whole site. I dont want to put anyone off. |
Posted By: Mishmish
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 3:54pm
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That is absolutely false. This is an anti-Islamic site that propagates misinformation. The Satanic Verses was a work of fiction written by Salman Rushdie. These meanings and the wording you quote for these verses were made up and ignorant people who have never even read the Quran have claimed them to be true. Much like The daVinci Code now. 53:19 Have ye seen Lat. and 'Uzza, 53:20 And another, the third (goddess), Manat? 53:21 What! For you the male sex, and for Him the female? 53:22 Behold, such would be a division most unfair! 53:23 These are nothing but names which ye have devised,- ye and your fathers,- for which Allah has sent down no authority (whatever). They follow nothing but conjecture and what their own souls desire!- Even though there has already come to them Guidance from their Lord! These are the correct verses, and to understand them you must read the whole Chapter. God is not telling anyone to worship these idols but rather to look at how base and degrading they are. That they are nothing but names, powerful only in men's minds. The Quran has never been changed. It is the same today as it was written at the time of the Prophet. Two of the original copies exist today, one in Istanbul and one in Tashkent. Anyone is free to go and examine these copies and compare them to the Qurans in print today. They are exactly the same, no word has been changed. This is a historical fact. ------------- It is only with the heart that one can see clearly, what is essential is invisible to the eye. (The Little Prince) |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 4:05pm
It's alrite. There are many anti-islamic & anti-christain websites. Anyone with internet connection and $10 in his pocket can make a website and post what-ever he wants. The main thing is that we get our information from the right websites. If you want I can post some websites that will help u to understand islam better, and I can also give you e-mail address of some scholars who can answer your questions. |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 4:09pm
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"If you want I can post some websites that will help u to understand islam better, and I can also give you e-mail address of some scholars who can answer your questions." that would be great! please do so. |
Posted By: Mishmish
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 4:23pm
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You can start right here on Islamicity. They have great resources including a Quran search and lots of articles. www.islamicity.com ------------- It is only with the heart that one can see clearly, what is essential is invisible to the eye. (The Little Prince) |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 4:29pm
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A Graduate Imam of Al Azhar [email protected] ICNA [email protected] Here are somewebsite that will help you to understand Islam better http://www.sunnipath.com/ - http://www.sunnipath.com/ http://www.islamonline.net/english/index.shtml - http://www.islamonline.net/english/index.shtml |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 5:24pm
53: 17 The sight (of Prophet Muhammad SAW) turned not aside (right or left), nor it transgressed beyond (the) limit (ordained for it). 18 Indeed he (Muhammad SAW) did see, of the Greatest Signs, of his Lord (All�h). 19 Have you then considered Al-L�t, and Al-'Uzza (two idols of the pagan Arabs) [] 20 And Man�t (another idol of the pagan Arabs), the other third? 21 Is it for you the males and for Him the females? 22 That indeed is a division most unfair! 23 They are but names which you have named, you and your fathers, for which All�h has sent down no authority. They follow but a guess and that which they themselves desire, whereas there has surely come to them the Guidance from their Lord! what proof you have that they were "abrogated"? nothing was deleted or added to quran, since it was revealed. People have tried many time, but they have always failed |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 5:26pm
| That above was a quote from an article I was reading so asking me for proof is moot. I was wondering about this claim and the verses that it attaches. |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 5:36pm
The Othman Koran was compiled in Medina by Othman, the third caliph or Muslim leader. Before him, the sacred verses which Muslims believe God gave to Muhammad were memorised, or written on pieces of wood or camel bone. To prevent disputes about which verses should be considered divinely inspired, Othman had this definitive version compiled. It was completed in the year 651, only 19 years after Muhammad's death. |
Posted By: DigitalStorm82
Date Posted: 23 April 2006 at 11:03pm
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Ok, I've read enough. I would like the christian members to please stop reading Anti-Islamic sites, if you truely want to understand what Islam really is.. and not what people think Islam is.. or what people acuse Islam of... Ask the muslims about Islam, and not the people who don't know anything about Islam in the first place. If I was to post that Jesus wasn't crucifed and bible has many contradictions... you would take offense to that wouldn't you? But I will not post that out of respect. Even though they are direct quotes from the bible. However, if you do want to learn more about it, just ask and I'll post it here. Its unfortunate, that Islam is perceived in such a negative manner and leads people to believe redicoulous things about Islam. And a request to all the muslim brothers and sisters here, dont start attacking the questioners even if they ask such harsh question and with no basis. They dont know any better about Islam, that is why they are asking. Asking is a step forward in the right direction. Ask them and treat them nicely, the true Islamic way. Jazakallah Khair ------------- Ma'Salama, Hamid |
Posted By: AhmadJoyia
Date Posted: 24 April 2006 at 8:10am
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Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 24 April 2006 at 4:45pm
The Christian missionaries have been trying all along to undermine the march of Islam by putting forth various fraudulent claims and allegations against Islam and the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). The charge you have mentioned above is only one of them, and it is really against Allah Almighty and His Prophet. They say that Satan was able to interpolate his own verses into the Qur�an, through the mouth of the Prophet. Their proof is a story culled from no less an authority on the early history of Islam than Abu Ja`far Muhammad ibn Jarir At-Tabari! While it is true that there is such a story narrated by At-Tabari, the critics of Islam do not consider the fact that he was simply repeating a story he got from other sources. Because At-Tabari himself wrote: �Hence, if I mention in this book a report about some men of the past, which the reader or listener finds objectionable or worthy of censure because he can see no aspect of truth nor any factual substance therein, let him know that this is not to be attributed to us but to those who transmitted it to us and we have merely passed this on as it has been passed on to us.� (Tarikh Al-Tabari: Tarikh Al-Umam wal-Muluk) This story is as follows: When the Muslims in Makkah were facing staunch opposition and persecution from the people of the Quraysh, the Prophet (peace be upon him) wished for a revelation that would help a reconciliation with his people. One day, while he was sitting with the Quraysh in one of their club houses around the Ka`bah, he recited to them Surat An-Najm. After reading the verses: *{Would you consider Al-Lat and Al-`Uzza? As well as Manat, the third goddess?}* (An-Najm 53:19-20), he is reported to have continued the recitation with the statement: �They are the goddesses on high. Their intercession is worthy of being sought.� He then proceeded with his reading of the surah as we know it. When he finished he prostrated himself, and all the Quraysh followed him. But later, the Prophet is reported to have changed his mind and blasphemed the same goddesses; and so the Quraysh reverted to persecution. Now the problems with this story are as follows: The story contradicts both the message of the Qur�an and the mission of the Prophet, namely to lead the world from the worship of many gods to the unconditional worship of the One and Only God. The Prophet, who was not tempted by the offer of the most coveted positions in Makkah besides all kinds of attractive offers from the people of the Quraysh, cannot be expected to yield to the kind of temptation mentioned in the story. Remember how he risked his own life and wealth and all for Allah; and how can we believe that he fell into such a silly trap? It is quite natural that he desired for a way to reconcile the hostile Quraysh; but we cannot imagine that he would stoop to this level as to recognize the pagan deities to the detriment of his life mission. What purpose does it serve? For this reason alone, we can dismiss this story out of hand. But consider certain other factors too. Allah has commanded us that the recitation of the verses of the Qur�an must begin compulsorily with the formula: �I seek refuge with Allah, from Satan the rejected.� If so, how can Satan hoodwink Allah Almighty, to interpolate verses into His Qur�an? From Allah�s own words in the Qur�an, we learn that Satan can trap only those humans who are basically prone to be his victims. In primordial time, when Satan was sent out of Paradise, Allah gave him respite. The Qur�an says what means: *{[Iblis] said: �O my Lord! give me then respite till the Day the [dead] are raised.� [God] said: �Respite is granted thee, till the Day of the time appointed.� [Iblis] said: �O my Lord! because Thou hast put me in the wrong, I will make [wrong] fair-seeming to them on the earth, and I will put them all in the wrong. Except Thy servants among them, sincere and purified [by Thy Grace].� [God] said: �This [way of My sincere servants] is indeed a way that leads straight to Me. For over My servants no authority shalt thou have, except such as put themselves in the wrong and follow thee.�}* (Al-Hijr 15:36-42) Note the last verse: *{For over My servants no authority shalt thou have, except such as put themselves in the wrong and follow thee.}* It is clear from this verse that Satan will have no power over Allah�s good servants, whoever they are. If this is so, how can we expect Allah Almighty�s final Messenger to be such a weak victim of caprice as to fail the standard expected of many of his own followers? And that, too, in the case of conveying the word of the All-Powerful, Ever-Watchful Sovereign Lord of the universe? The Christian critics may note that according to their own Bible, the Son of God was tempted by Satan: �Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them; And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me� (Matthew 4:8-9). Here we see how Satan takes the Son of God (i.e., God Himself!) to �an exceeding high mountain� by his cunning, to tempt him with the offer of the kingdoms of the world, if only God falls down and worships Satan! The Christians read the above as gospel truth; and so they may wonder why we go to this extent to prove the falsity of the charge against Muhammad (peace be upon him), a mere mortal. Indeed, the expression, �Satanic verses� was popularized by Salman Rushdie, who got the idea from Christian sources. The missionaries were delighted to hail the Islamophobic author and his book, as they do not waste any opportunity that comes by to bash Muslims. By way of conclusion we can say: Even if we accepted the allegation as true, the verse attributed to Satan is not there in the Qur�an: There is no Satanic verse in the Qur�an. Absolutely not. No one can dispute the fact that the mission of Muhammad (peace be upon him) was basically to fight idolatry and polytheism at all costs, by all means. And so the allegation that he tried to appease idolaters is at best a miserable and ludicrous bid by the enemies of Islam to denigrate God and His last Prophet. The very life of the Prophet offers the strongest denial of the charge, rather than any written refutation. And Allah knows best. Thank you and Salam |
Posted By: Cicely
Date Posted: 24 April 2006 at 8:18pm
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I want to say thank you to the above Muslims who have made the EFFORT to answer my question without getting personally defensive, particularly because I didn't give my opinion, i merely restated some things that I have read and heard. I do want to point out that just because someone does not agree with the particular doctrine that Muslims adhere to and give reasons why does not make them "anti-Muslim" (I'm not talking about myself per se, I mean a few of the references I have read) any more than when a Muslim tries to debate a Christian doctrine. I do think, however, that this is a circular arguement subject to opinion and feeling and many (not all) of the answers I have gotten in return have demonstrated this. I suggest that instead of being defensive, one tries to understand where the questioner is coming from and ask more questions if there seems to be a misunderstanding instead of becoming defensive. I also realize that from a few of the most previous answers, Muslims often truly do not understand Who Christ is to Christians and why we believe that it is absurd to assert that Jesus' ministry needs "fixing" or "completion". Jesus was called a "perfect man" by Muslims I know, but even the Quran says that Muhammed made some serious mistakes. Other "prophets" have done so as well, but the difference is that Jesus did not make those mistakes. But I suppose that if one dismisses the accuracy of the New Testament to some alleged conspiracy theory, then this argument is to be dismissed. I could answer the person who said Jesus called a woman a dog, but it would be beside the point. I was under the impression that this thread was for NON-MUSLIMS to pose questions to Muslims to gain understanding or to challenge something that one may not agree with. Apparently this is not the case. I am very disappointed in the majority of response I received to my questions, aside from the few that did. to those who sincerely tried to understand what I was asking, thank you and God bless you. I will take the suggestions and utilize them and consider them. However I would urge others to truly consider how they are to be a witness of their faith. I am not a perfect witness, but God carries me in His infinite grace to be the best witness I can of Christ Jesus and His sacrifice. May God lead you to His Truth. |
Posted By: DigitalStorm82
Date Posted: 24 April 2006 at 8:22pm
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Ok, one more comment. I don't know where your reading about Islam but I hope you find a new website. Because porphet mohammad didn't make any mistakes. ------------- Ma'Salama, Hamid |
Posted By: Mishmish
Date Posted: 24 April 2006 at 8:39pm
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We like to thank the Christians who come to this site and phrase their questions in a polite and delicate manner so as not to offend Muslims or cause them to become defensive. It makes it so much easier to answer when someone asks a question about a belief without stating it to be so, and with an open mind.
------------- It is only with the heart that one can see clearly, what is essential is invisible to the eye. (The Little Prince) |
Posted By: AhmadJoyia
Date Posted: 25 April 2006 at 7:09am
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Posted By: superme
Date Posted: 25 April 2006 at 10:22pm
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In case some of the muslims have not heard this - this topic that cicely brought is not new nor it is an outsider design. This so called "Satanic verses" topic came from the muslim sources itself, by Tabari - the famous historian. The point of this story is, that The Prophet (Pbuh) was so cornered while in Mekkah with the Quraish resisting his message furiously and with only handful of followers after number of years. Because that he cave in to their demand - in recognizing their beloved gods as intercessors also beside God. Jibril noticed the addition of two verses in chapter 53, and he removed them. Anyway that is how the story runs roughly, a bit more or less does not really matter, I never worry with stories pretty much. If you want to master it - it is always availabe through the search engines. Aside from this, the first 10 verses will make us think of what it is. |
Posted By: ak_m_f
Date Posted: 25 April 2006 at 10:46pm
already discussed, read my previous post in this topic |
Posted By: superme
Date Posted: 25 April 2006 at 11:04pm
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Oop sorry, typical one of the day. |
Posted By: Srya
Date Posted: 25 April 2006 at 11:23pm
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Salem, I have been doing alot of research, studying etc and I came accross something on a website that to me did not llook anti Islamic. However, I just read something like I will paste below. Then, I got out. Because to me it just didn't sound right. It bothered me. Cicley wrote:Muhammed wanted to kill himself and thought he was going mad? this is according to exerpts from his biography. Just because this site is not by muslims does not mean its claims should be dismissed; rather, they should be addressed and clarified if they are incorrect or taken out of context. I am wanting to get a better understanding of the life of Muhammed (pbuh) than what I have. It is so upsetting though that there are so many anti islamic websites out there.For someone like me who is new, who wants to learn about Muhammed (pbuh) and the get a better understanding of what kind of man he was; gets clouded by these awful masked websites. |
Posted By: AhmadJoyia
Date Posted: 26 April 2006 at 9:47am
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Walikum us Salam sis Suzanne, So whats your argument about? The 'something' you pasted is simply an opinion without providing any reference to it. Is that they way of doing research? I don't think. Kindly assure references very deligently to avoid later embarrassments in your own views based on 'fictatious' references. |
Posted By: Srya
Date Posted: 26 April 2006 at 12:12pm
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Salem AhmadJoyia, I have no argument. Where is that coming from?I was merely making an observation; and YES what I pasted I know that it is simply an opinion. Did I say otherwise? Or, did you not see that those are not my views they are from another member? You typed: Is that they way of doing research? I don't think I am assuming you typed this in response to what I put. I will paste here: am wanting to get a better understanding of the life of Muhammad (pbuh) than what I have. It is so upsetting though that there are so many anti Islamic websites out there. For someone like me who is new, who wants to learn about Muhammad (pbuh) and the get a better understanding of what kind of man he was; gets clouded by these awful masked websites. I can not say any clearer than what I typed. I will suggest something to you what you posted except with references replace with reading other members posts and understanding what they are saying than taking offence to it: Kindly assure (references) very deligently to avoid later embarrassments in your own views based on 'fictitious' references.
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Posted By: AhmadJoyia
Date Posted: 26 April 2006 at 1:09pm
| Oh! Did I offend someone? I am really sorry for that. I never intended but gave an honest suggestion. In doing so, I felt that repeating someone's fictatious opinon is same as promoting his views. Also, these didn't merit a bit of consideration at all. Kindly see that the originator of these comments has not pressed the arguments on it other than leaving it for others to pick themselves to have discussion on it. Best we can do, in such situations is to ask him/her to provide the reference for his info. This act alone, I think, would be sufficient to make him realize his/her mistake. Peace. |
Posted By: Srya
Date Posted: 26 April 2006 at 2:25pm
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Salem AhmadJoyia, You typed:Oh! Did I offend someone? That is a rhetorical question. Because it's obvious on your reply; also since you responded twice to my posts you should know my Name is Suzanne. But, I would like for you to know your apology is accepted anyway. Thanks. You typed:" I felt that repeating someone's fictitious opinion is same as promoting his views. " "Same as promoting his views"??? Please WHO is the person you are referring to? What views are you referring to? This is also a possible rhetorical question to me. Considering my replay to your post. My opinion my efforts to take the time to explain to you what was clearly obvious I hope has not gone overlooked again. However, once should not assume. So, before I continue on this issue. I will wait for your response. Please. You also typed:" Kindly see that the originator of these comments has not pressed the arguments on it" This is a suggestion to me to take notice. However, where in my post did I imply otherwise? Again, I was making an observation. Second time reinterating this. I find this interesting what you typed in the next sentence. You choose to use the word "pick". But, brother are you not doing exactly what you are accusing others of doing? Because, all I did AGAIN was make an observation (3rd). I did cut and paste also typed my opinion. From viewing your posts in this thread you have also done the same with opinion and cut & paste. So, please clear this up for me. |
Posted By: Mishmish
Date Posted: 26 April 2006 at 3:04pm
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Assalamu Alaikum: Sister Suzanne, there is a wonderful book called: AR-RAHEEQ AL-MAKHTUM (The Sealed Nectar) by Safi-ur-Rahman Al-Mubarakpuri. It is a biography of the Prophet's (PBUH) life and is very detailed.
------------- It is only with the heart that one can see clearly, what is essential is invisible to the eye. (The Little Prince) |
Posted By: AhmadJoyia
Date Posted: 26 April 2006 at 3:05pm
| Oh! I give up sis. I really mean it. Kindly continue on the topic discussion rather than nailing me down through hair spliting. Just think, I am nothing and no body. Just ignore what ever I said. I apologize, sincerely. Kindly argue the topic or ask questions, or what ever you want. Peace. |
Posted By: Srya
Date Posted: 26 April 2006 at 6:47pm
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Salem Mishmish, Inshallah I will check it out. |
Posted By: superme
Date Posted: 27 April 2006 at 2:14am
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When I first time heard this so called "Satanic verses" topic the first thing I did was by checking the chapter itself as we have it today, regradless of what the historians has penned it down or tafsir. Put it simply chapter 53 as we have it now and that's all we have. But as I suspect, I did not and still don't know how to connect the chapter with history which was written long after the completion of the Qur'an. One of the good example to see this type is, when Rosulallah, Sollallahu alaihi wasallam just passed away. The whole community was in chaos after living with him for 23 years as their leader - and for all sudden he was not there. Umar bin Khattab declared that he would kill anyone who dare to say that Mukhammad is dead. In that time Abu Bakr stood up and read a verse, this is the verse he read: Muhammad is but a messenger, messengers (the like of whom) have passed away before him. Will it be that, when he dieth or is slain, ye will turn back on your heels ? He who turneth back on his heels doth no hurt to Allah, and Allah will reward the thankful. (3:144) So according to history when Umar heard this ayah he said he never heard it, or as though he never heard it. Here is the point to ponder. The verse quoted as though it is a match with the commotion penned in the history. OR was this verse revealed AFTER the Prophet died? I am only trying to make a point here - not to connect the spiritual purpose of the Qur'an with the historical stuff. The "Satanic verses" is fully derived from historical point of view. As we know this kind of thing is always attracting interest. Btw I like controversies myself. I hope this does help especially for sister Suzanne. I will post more for this if I have more, inshaallah. |