What we still don't understand about Hizbollah

This week, world terrorism expert Robert Pape will share with the FBI the findings of his remarkable study of 462 suicide bombings. He concludes that such acts have little to do with religious extremism and that the West must engage politically to halt the relentless slaughter
Sunday August 6, 2006
http://www.observer.co.uk/ - The Observer

Israel has finally conceded that air power alone will not defeat Hizbollah. Over the coming weeks, it will learn that ground power won't work either. The problem is not that the Israelis have insufficient military might, but that they misunderstand the nature of the enemy.

In terms of structure and hierarchy, it is less comparable with, say, a religious cult such as the Taliban than to the multi-dimensional American civil rights movement of the 1960s. What made its rise so rapid, and will make it impossible to defeat militarily, was not its international support but the fact that it evolved from a reorientation of pre-existing Lebanese social groups.

Evidence of the broad nature of Hizbollah's resistance to Israeli occupation can be seen in the identity of its suicide attackers. Hizbollah conducted a broad campaign of suicide bombings against American, French and Israeli targets from 1982 to 1986. Altogether, these attacks, which included the infamous bombing of the marine barracks in Beirut in 1983, involved 41 suicide terrorists.

Researching my book, which covered all 462 suicide bombings around the globe, I had colleagues scour Lebanese sources to collect martyr videos, pictures and testimonials and biographies of the Hizbollah bombers. Of the 41, we identified the names, birth places and other personal data for 38. We were shocked to find that only eight were Islamic fundamentalists; 27 were from leftist political groups such as the Lebanese Communist Party and the Arab Socialist Union; three were Christians, including a female secondary school teacher with a college degree. All were born in Lebanon.

What these suicide attackers - and their heirs today - shared was not a religious or political ideology but simply a commitment to resisting a foreign occupation. Nearly two decades of Israeli military presence did not root out Hizbollah. The only thing that has proven to end suicide attacks, in Lebanon and elsewhere, is withdrawal by the occupying force.

Previous analyses of suicide terrorism have not had the benefit of a complete survey of all suicide terrorist attacks worldwide. The lack of complete data, together with the fact that many such attacks, including all those against Americans, have been committed by Muslims, has led many in the US to assume that Islamic fundamentalism must be the underlying main cause. This, in turn, has fuelled a belief that anti-American terrorism can be stopped only by wholesale transformation of Muslim societies, which helped create public support of the invasion of Iraq. But study of the phenomenon of suicide terrorism shows that the presumed connection to Islamic fundamentalism is misleading.

There is not the close connection between suicide terrorism and Islamic fundamentalism that many people think. Rather, what nearly all suicide terrorist campaigns have in common is a specific secular and strategic goal: to compel democracies to withdraw military forces from territory that the terrorists consider to be their homeland.

Religion is rarely the root cause, although it is often used as a tool by terrorist organisations in recruiting and in other efforts in service of the broader strategic objective. Most often, it is a response to foreign occupation.

Understanding that suicide terrorism is not a product of Islamic fundamentalism has important implications for how the US and its allies should conduct the war on terrorism. Spreading democracy across the Persian Gulf is not likely to be a panacea as long as foreign troops remain on the Arabian peninsula. The obvious solution might well be simply to abandon the region altogether. Isolationism, however, is not possible; America needs a new strategy that pursues its vital interest in oil but does not stimulate the rise of a new generation of suicide terrorists. The same is true of Israel now.

The new Israeli land offensive may take ground and destroy weapons, but it has little chance of destroying Hizbollah. In fact, in the wake of the bombings of civilians, the incursion will probably aid Hizbollah's recruiting.

Equally important, Israel's incursion is also squandering the goodwill it had initially earned from so-called moderate Arab states such as Egypt and Saudi Arabia. The countries are the court of opinion that matters because, while Israel cannot crush Hizbollah, it could achieve a more limited goal: ending Hizbollah's acquisition of more missiles through Syria.

Given Syria's total control of its border with Lebanon, stemming the flow of weapons is a job for diplomacy, not force. Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Jordan, Sunni-led nations that want stability in the region, are motivated to stop the rise of Hizbollah. Under the right conditions, the US might be able to help assemble an ad hoc coalition of Syria's neighbours to entice and bully it to prevent Iranian, Chinese or other foreign missiles from entering Lebanon. It could also offer to begin talks over the future of the Golan Heights.

But Israel must take the initiative. Unless it calls off the offensive and accepts a genuine ceasefire, there are likely to be many, many dead Israelis in the coming weeks - and a much stronger Hizbollah.

I think people need to get their focus off america  

I think people need to get their focus off america 

And, 'ave it on the other idiot, 'oward, instead?

Brother, if the point of his paper is to justify suicider bombers I basically refuted that with a few sentences see the listed above thread.

Brother, 'ave you read the whole article? It makes a lot more sense than you may wish to see in it. It's neither promoting nor denouncing the bombers. It recognises the fact that occupation ferment suicide bombers.

Sometimes we need to heed facts and, as in the precinct lingo goes, get the real buggers.

To try to twist suicide bombers into something other than what they are, hatefilled, brainwashed young muslims, is ludicrous.  Nothing is going to get better unless the hate stops.  No win situation for everyone.  We can continue to spread hatred and pretend that suicide bombers are not "really so bad", or we can sit down and try to stop hating each other.   The decision to continue this intense hatred of anyone different from "me" will be the demise of civilization, and again, no one will win.

Have you tried to read the article my most revered Hate Shouter?

Please try and read it, it is in English and says almost all about what creates suicide bombers + it IS by an AMERICAN - who says that Majority of sicide bombers WERE NOT MUSLIMS.

First read and only then start jumping up and down on the poor key-board AND ask your government to stop sowing the seeds of hate with their OCCUPATIONS.

Do you understand or would you need me to spell it out a wee more?

[tongue-in-cheek mode on]

Gee, is research demonstrating that there is a correlation between suicide bombing and foreign military occupation?  Until now, I thought that all suicide bombers were Muslims and that Muslims were just sort of a race apart, with something amiss in their religio-genetic structure that makes them want to blow themselves and others up.

Science, even arguable science, is amazing!

Serv

[tongue-in-cheek mode off]

er...

Servetus wrote: [tongue-in-cheek mode on] Quote: What these suicide attackers - and their heirs today - shared was not a religious or political ideology but simply a commitment to resisting a foreign occupation. Gee, is research demonstrating that there is a correlation between suicide bombing and foreign military occupation?  Until now, I thought that all suicide bombers were Muslims and that Muslims were just sort of a race apart, with something amiss in their religio-genetic structure that makes them want to blow themselves and others up. Science, even arguable science, is amazing! Serv   [tongue-in-cheek mode off]

Whisper wrote: Have you tried to read the article my most revered Hate Shouter? Please try and read it, it is in English and says almost all about what creates suicide bombers + it IS by an AMERICAN - who says that Majority of sicide bombers WERE NOT MUSLIMS. First read and only then start jumping up and down on the poor key-board AND ask your government to stop sowing the seeds of hate with their OCCUPATIONS. Do you understand or would you need me to spell it out a wee more?

I don't want or expect anything from you "whisper".  You are somewhat of a god to many here, but I see you as I see everyone else....just another human being.  You call me a "hater"?  What a joke!  I don't hate anyone....not you, not anyone.  Can you say the same with an honest heart?  I could do without your unfunny sarcasm, but, hey, that's your personality....so have at it.  Oh, I know how to read English quite well, and some other languages as well.  I'm just sick of YOUR constant bashing and hatred....but many hear seem to enjoy it, so I guess it only adds to your popularity.  I have remained quiet while you ranted many times --- out of respect and a request to do so from a dear friend.  I don't give a rat's patoot what you say about me....I'm numb you see, not much can hurt me anymore.

However, for those interested, here's an article of interest.

http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/srilanka/feature2.html - http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/srilanka/feature2. html

Madam, please read my post, I addressed you as the most revered Hate Shouter not as Hater.

It's not my personality, but something that fakes bring out in me.

Kindly read the posts in the threads properly before peddling some irrelevant links. This thread is about: Researching my book, which covered all 462 suicide bombings around the globe, I had colleagues scour Lebanese sources to collect martyr videos, pictures and testimonials and biographies of the Hizbollah bombers. Of the 41, we identified the names, birth places and other personal data for 38. We were shocked to find that only eight were Islamic fundamentalists; 27 were from leftist political groups such as the Lebanese Communist Party and the Arab Socialist Union; three were Christians, including a female secondary school teacher with a college degree. All were born in Lebanon.

If you have any problem with the contents, construction or the meanings of this article, kindly, address your concerns to Prof Robert Pape at the University of Chicago instead of levelling your sermons at me.

Patty,

Sorry to disagree with you but I read nothing anywhere close to what you read into this article.  This article was neither condoning or trying to make suicide bombings ok.  In fact I think it was trying to do the exact opposite.  Rule #1 of war is to understand your enemy.  Rule #2 of war (according to me...;)) is not to even get into a war.  That is how you win wars...lol.  In any case, the only way to "win" the war is to ensure that both sides win.  What do we want?  We want the suicide bombings to stop.  What do the suicide bombers want? For us to quit occupying their land.  I say, we leave and they stop.  Win win.

However, the policy to not negotiate with terrorists is not working.  As stated on the article (and by mere observation of what is going on in the world) it is making things worse.  What business do we have to be occupying their land?  How would you feel if I came into your house and told you what to do, and in the case of Israel and Palestine, how would you feel if I moved into your your house and told you to live in the basement?  and then went ahead and took over your basement too and made you live in your bathroom?  That is what Israel did to Palestinians.... they relegated them to the Gaza strip which is the least desirable piece of land in the area (the comments made in blue were told to me by a Palestinian friend... if they are misinformed in any way, pls feel free to correct me).

I think it is foolish to read basic research that gives you honest facts and totally dismiss it.  I think it is even more foolish for someone to give you information that will help you win (i.e. stop the killings) and then completely dismiss it. 

Sorry sister Patty but I read no hatred or condoning of terrorism in the article I only saw someone trying to help by providing insight into the problem AND recommendations that will help end the terrorism in a way that is beneficial for both the people of the area (they get peace) and the people of America (they get their oil...)

My own pet notion (not supported by a lot of formal data) is that the indoctrination team induces and exaggerates

Great idea!

Shall we now all stand up and cheer: "occupations ain't gaat anything to do with it"?

Assalamu alaikum,

Sister Hanan, you never fail to make my day!  You remind me of me when I was young and could still articulate well...........you are a fresh breeze with a salty bite.

peace, ummziba.

runner wrote: Hanan wrote: Assalamu Aleikum Thank you, Sister Ummziba, for mistakenly implying that I�m a young and well articulate woman. You have made MY day  I live among the Above Mentioned and know them well. Most of us know that they are NOT here to contribute anything meaningful. Their main purpose is to vent their barely disguised hatred and distain for Muslims/Arabs, but we should not fool ourselves and believe that they�re NOT doing the same thing on African-American and Pro-Jewish forums. I have �chased� them from Topic to Topic, trying to exchange views/opinions/have a dialogue, but all they do is run. Although they would never intended to make me appear smart and knowledgeable on issues posted here, they have done exactly that. Talking to them is like talking to Dubya - you can never get a straight answer and you�re always accused of �hating them.� I often sit in amazement and feel very humble when I read the insightful and honest contributions of many participants here, and they are the my guides and educators and my reason for being here. Waasalam Wasalaam Sr. Hanan.  Shaytan makes it seem far too attractive for some of us to neglect to think seriously about the remarks of others, and feel quite self-satisfied to think of a clever but irrelevant response to another's thoughtful question or statement. This happens among those of both sides, and is a genuine impediment to enlightenment and understanding for both.  It's also not worthy of a Muslim...or anyone else.  Perhaps this kind of talking past rather than with is responsible in many places for much of the world's bloodshed and sorrow.

Exactly so, Runner.