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Israfil 
Senior Member
Joined: 08 September 2003
Status: Offline
Points: 3984
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 Topic: I�m going to Hell!
Posted: 03 June 2006 at 3:24pm |
As'Salaamu alaikum
Before I comment I'd like to say that I agree with Angela, my intention was not to make this an all-Muslim discussion. My intention was to have all members of various sects and of various faiths share in this discussion. This subject applies to all people of religious/spiritual convictions. This truly annoys me that moderators assume what is the best interest of the board as I know several moves based on the "interest" of the boards were clearly a mistake. Again as I assume I'm not respected here (for reasons unknown to me). I'm going to ask the moderators nicely (although I know being nice here doesn't get you nowhere) if they could move this to the interfaith section. Honestly, I don't want just a Muslim opinion I want a universal opinion here.
if I'm rejected of this plea then its obvious that "reserving the right" also means reserving control over who says what. Abrah I'm currenly doing some tudying with my classmates so later on I'll give you a reply.
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herjihad
Senior Member
Joined: 26 January 2005
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 2473
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Posted: 02 June 2006 at 10:48am |
 Israfil wrote:
The title is catchy isn't it?
Sister Mishmish gave 10 reasons why Fred should be Muslim. I can give 10 reasons why we should choose Islam for other reasons. Actually in one of those statements was eternal paradise. I as a Muslim even with reading the Qur'an and reading some of the Hadith can be clearly convinced that non-Muslims are doomed for Hell. Hell exist here in this world for some and some live their lives only knowing what they were raised with. for our religious envoys this is enough to proseltyze and convert people to their faith.
I am perhaps more "liberal" in the sense of this theological belief for I believe that God is the most knowledgable of all of creation. This is a reason why we call God a supernatural deity, because he can defy all rules of reality. One of the reasons why I don't defined Godn in the sense of attributing to him like "the Most this" "the most that" except through formal Islamic greetings is because we contradict ourselves everytime. The underline question can be ask: "If God is the most merciful why would he condemn an atheist man to hell?" Good question.
What if that atheist is suffering from a complexity which stem from greif of losing a loved one or a crisis of faith? There are some many mysterious variables why we believe why we believe and none of us should define them with our doctrines. I've had missionaries call me "son of the devil" I've had members here say my mother is going to hell because she was a Christian. We sure limit God. We limit God with doctrine, with words even with food.
Eternal Paradise is being closes to God as possible and feeling an untainted and undying love from something far greater than your own spiritual being. God the artisan, is the judge of all beings in the universe and like Plato said :"True knowledge comes after death."
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Bismillah,
Yes, very catchy! I especially agree with the part in red. When people quote our Holy Quran to support what they believe is true, they interperet it to support their claims. So each of us could do that. I see things from your and Angela's points of view maybe because I love many non-Muslims, but I think it's probably because that's what makes sense to me and my faith in Allah, SWT. My faith belongs to me. It is my personal relationship with Allah. I don't give permission to anyone to mess with that. And I definitely believe that only Allah, SWT, knows who the ungrateful disbelievers are.
During the blessed Prophet Muhammad's time, he knew when Allah, The All-Knowing, informed him and he shared that with the people around him. I will make the judgment that we shouldn't --through possibly incorrect understanding -- decide for ourselves who is and is not going to heaven or hell. Let's just enjoin good behavior, the most important of which is belief in the All Mighty.
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Al-Hamdulillah (From a Married Muslimah) La Howla Wa La Quwata Illa BiLLah - There is no Effort or Power except with Allah's Will.
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Angela
Senior Member
Joined: 11 July 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 2555
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Posted: 02 June 2006 at 10:25am |
AbRah2006 wrote:
And give good news (O Muhammad) to those who believe and do good deeds, that they will have gardens (Paradise) in which rivers flow.... (Quran, 2:25)
God has also said:
Race one with another for forgiveness from your Lord and for Paradise, whose width is as the width of the heavens and the earth, which has been prepared for those who believe in God and His messengers.... (Quran, 57:21)
God has said in the Quran:
But those who believe and do good deeds, We will admit them to gardens (Paradise) in which rivers flow, lasting in them forever.... (Quran, 4:57)
What are you going to do next? Belittling me?
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From these quotes, I would think that one must do more than just believe. One must still do the good deeds? Or am I wrong, is just believing enough?
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AbRah2006
Guest Group
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 354
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Posted: 02 June 2006 at 10:23am |
Angela wrote:
Is not Pride a sin? The Lack of Compassion? Testifying to a Lie? There are many sins. Just because you are "muslim" doesn't mean you're going to Heaven. If anything, a Muslim who claims to be Muslim, yet does not practice what he preaches would be in more danger of hell than someone who is a good person and practices what they know to be the truth. I know a few Muslims (or maybe the better term is Arabs, since they do not practice their faith) who drink, have sex and live unrighteous lives having been raised with the Quran and the teachings of Islam. Then there is my Grandmother, who is a hardworking Christian woman, who never judges anyone, always does charity, helps anyone in need, prays and reads her Bible daily. Who is leading a more righteous life? Isn't it true in Islam a good deed erases a bad deed? If you live all your life doing far more good than bad, what will the end result be???? |
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God has said in the Quran: |
Those who have disbelieved and died in disbelief, the earth full of gold would not be accepted from any of them if one offered it as a ransom. They will have a painful punishment, and they will have no helpers. (Quran, 3:91)
If you could but see when they are set before the Fire (Hell) and say, �Would that we might return (to the world)! Then we would not reject the verses of our Lord, but we would be of the believers!� (Quran, 6:27)
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God does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you about religion and have not driven you out of your homes. God loves just dealers. (Quran, 60:8)
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AbRah2006
Guest Group
Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: United States
Status: Offline
Points: 354
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Posted: 02 June 2006 at 10:19am |
fredifreeloader wrote:
abrah said:
"Yes Allah will be the judge but Allah will not contradict His own Word! Muslims are going to heaven and non-believers will go to HELL !"
abrah - prove to me from the quran that youre going to heaven
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I know that it is pointless to show you the Quranic verse since the Muslims have shown you a lot of Quranic verses but you do not appreciate them! You make fun of them !
Here are the Quranic verses:
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God has said in the Quran: |
And give good news (O Muhammad) to those who believe and do good deeds, that they will have gardens (Paradise) in which rivers flow.... (Quran, 2:25)
God has also said:
Race one with another for forgiveness from your Lord and for Paradise, whose width is as the width of the heavens and the earth, which has been prepared for those who believe in God and His messengers.... (Quran, 57:21)
God has said in the Quran:
But those who believe and do good deeds, We will admit them to gardens (Paradise) in which rivers flow, lasting in them forever.... (Quran, 4:57)
What are you going to do next? Belittling me?
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God does not forbid you from showing kindness and dealing justly with those who have not fought you about religion and have not driven you out of your homes. God loves just dealers. (Quran, 60:8)
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Angela
Senior Member
Joined: 11 July 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 2555
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Posted: 02 June 2006 at 10:06am |
Israfil wrote:
Why do you guys (moderators) keep moving my subjects to Intrafaith, clearly this subject addresses all montheistic religions who believe in this eschatology |
Peacemaker,
Israfil did not intend this to be an INTRAfaith discussion.....so move it back to INTERfaith.
Edit: Yes, it was in interfaith. And later as it developed, it was moved to intrafaith. The best thing would be to post and discuss the matter where it belongs. Thanks for you comment anyway. ---Peacemaker
Edited by peacemaker
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peacemaker
Moderator Group
Male
Joined: 29 December 2005
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 3057
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Posted: 02 June 2006 at 9:51am |
Assalamu Alaikum!
No offense intended to anyone. Intrafaith section is for Muslims alone, who may or may not belong to sects. Therefore, I respectfully ask those who are not Muslims to stay away from this section.
Peace
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Then which of the favours of your Lord will ye deny?
Qur'an 55:13
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Angela
Senior Member
Joined: 11 July 2005
Status: Offline
Points: 2555
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Posted: 02 June 2006 at 9:43am |
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Is not Pride a sin? The Lack of Compassion? Testifying to a Lie? There are many sins. Just because you are "muslim" doesn't mean you're going to Heaven. If anything, a Muslim who claims to be Muslim, yet does not practice what he preaches would be in more danger of hell than someone who is a good person and practices what they know to be the truth. I know a few Muslims (or maybe the better term is Arabs, since they do not practice their faith) who drink, have sex and live unrighteous lives having been raised with the Quran and the teachings of Islam. Then there is my Grandmother, who is a hardworking Christian woman, who never judges anyone, always does charity, helps anyone in need, prays and reads her Bible daily. Who is leading a more righteous life? Isn't it true in Islam a good deed erases a bad deed? If you live all your life doing far more good than bad, what will the end result be????
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I�m going to Hell!