Gay muslims?

Chrysalis wrote: Gibbs wrote: Now the basis of the religionist argument is religious mixed with biology. One, God made male and female to procreate and populate the planet anything opposing that is a choice. Actually, for us Muslims - the basis of rejecting Homosexuality as acceptable behavior is because Allah said so. Full stop. However, as humans we make attempts to find reasons and logic to convince either ourselves or others as to why. Or to contemplate upon supposed reasons. . . natural curiosity.[Quote] Because Allah said so.....and you called my previous comment "weak logic."

There seems to have been a recent trend in which Science looks for biological or genetic reasons to explain every behavior of ours. I don't think that every tendency of ours has a genetic or biological reason. The recent trend in the West seems to be finding excuses to excuse bad or abnormal behavior as "Aww, its not your fault. Its your DNA". And when you start thinking "its not in your hands" you fall back on the excuse rather than taking responsibility for your actions. And I'm not just referring to homosexuality, at least its doesn't effect others - but other actions like alcoholism, compulsive stealing (whats it called again ?) etc etc. We as human beings have the tendency and ability to develop a liking to almost anything. Developing personal preferences does not always make it natural or biological. If so, then what about Serial Killers or Rapists who have the urge to inflict harm on others & derive pleasure from it ? There so many kinds of perversions existing today - I am sure all of them claim "they cannot help it". I guess Paedophiles cannot help bieng attracted to kids either . . . lets excuse them too. I am not finding excuses for all these perverted behaviours - simply saying that the theory "if its natural & biological - its okay and not your fault" is faulty.

I think you are oversimplifying things. Science (in my opinion) doesn't justify deviant human behavior by looking at genes as the sole reason for deviant behavior. I think many scientist researchers look at contributing factor for deviant behavior but its typical that religionist think science is trying to answer everything since thr media has made the presentation of scientific discovery possible. No offense, but last time I checked the Bible, Quran, or Torah had nothing about pancreatic cancer and treating it. So instead of relying on holy books to treat cancer patients we rely on medication treatment which science has made possible. When speaking on pedophilia and other perverse behavior you would have to do personal research but just because someone is a pedophile or does odd behavior doesn't always mean porn caused them to do it. There is a condition called Bilateral temporal lesions which causes hypersexuality that is, it may contribute to pedophilia.

I also can't believe you quoted Alfred Kinsey. His stuff is like old. I am talking about 30 plus years old. When I was in college some...."years ago" I did a presentation on this guy and although he contributed greatly on human sexuality in psychology that stuff changes over time and besides his research studies were done on his students which is not representative of the whole population. Did you know that Chrysalis? Anyway,
This is another example of seeing what you want to see. Yes we all unconsciously have fantasies of the same sex. Hell, babies masturbate but you aren't proving your case that homosexuality is a choice but individual preference. Before we choose or prefer something, the attraction to a thing has an origin.

Let me test your wits Chrysalis. Imagine a 17 year-old Muslim male named Ahmad living in egypt. He has a prominent family and he (Ahmad) is currently in college. His parents plan on arranging him to be married but in the meantime Ahmad is trying to get his degree. However Ahmad is not happy about being married because deep down Ahmad has always had an attraction to men. I know this is a made up scenarioo but can you show or elaborate how Ahmad chooses to have those feelings?

Chrysalis excuse me for saying "gay muslim" how about a male or female who is gay but religion is Islam. By the way something that I forgot to mention in my last post to you was, when I told you about how islamic law limits human potential I defined it as one who expresses themselves full that includes being a movie star, porn star, or expressing their personality that is hetero or homosexuality.

Um being raised in a social setting is environmental so I don't understand. If I'm raised as a boy playing with toy trucks and guns (gender specific toys) and I grow up and turn gay what about my environment influences me being gay? You also said influences.....what other influences?

Edited by Gibbs - 31 December 2009 at 10:58am

Sign*Reader wrote: ops155 wrote: I have a question for all Muslims... Why is it that you can judge an entire group of peaceful people whom you have never met Peaceful... as the Brits would say my bloody foot! Most corruption is not necessarily gunslinger based... the laws being forced down passed through the corrupt whore hopping politicians likes of Clinton and fag Barney Frank et al are no less... figures, shows your bias, I believe you are so scared of gay people because you have had some of the same feelings, its ok, no one will tell your family. They are in your face having other nations to tow the American liberalism line is the reality of this mentality and also a mark of Jewish economic and cultural control that is galling!  once again, blame the west and jews ops155 wrote: yet you don't think Christians should be able to judge all Muslims and condemn them for not believing in Christ? Oh really! haven't they tried this for last two centuries and failed miserably...but yes they did colonize them and now the struggle of Muslim liberation is shaking the Christian apple cart...As a matter of fact the first thing the Christians were supposed to do was to convince the Jews about the Messiah instead they have become their slaves and doing all the dirty work fighting wars for material on their behalf if you can swallow this truth! Have you ever talked to an Israeli about Christianity and gotten sopat on your face? The Christ came for the children of Israel to stop their money changers business in the Temple but the Paul or Saul found the pagan Europeans a better lot to marry in! BTW The Christians have nothing to do with Christ...He will disown you in a heart beat when he will come face to face to so called Christians, Zionist Christians and what have you! I didn't ask about what was being done to muslims from christians, i said do you believe it is ok for us to discriminate against all muslims since you don't believe the way we do? It is exactly what you are doing to gay people. ops155 wrote: There is endless evidence that sexual orientation is from birth and not choice. yet religion is 100 % choice. You are talking from both ends of your mouth... The idiocy is congenital and then want it indoctrinated as normal...It seems you are equating homosexuality with religion...Normal sex is denied to Catholic priesthood and then end up sticking to the poor boys in the rectory so what gives? I admit we have some bad priests, no suprise there. Are you trying to say you don't have any religious figures that have led people astray or did wrong? ops155 wrote: Before anyone says I am pro gay, I'm not. As if some one here gives a hoot about your being one or not!   I guess some do because in past when I made a argument for gays I was accused of being one myself.     ops155 wrote: but I do believe in freedom for people to make their own choices as long as it doesn't harm others. The disease level of STD HIV and death rate amongst gays blows your thesis out of the water! That effects cost of health care for the rest and makes hostages out of normal people cuz it is politically incorrect! So can we start to put all the fat people down because they cost us more in healthcare than any other group out there? Even smokers. So all you chubbies, sign up to be put down. ops155 wrote: So even if your choice is not the one I would make there is nothing I can do about it because it is none of my business. Muslims and actually religious people in general always talk about not judging others and only god himself can judge people yet you bring up a gay man and the judging is off the charts. As long as they keep it to themselves and not have the laws made favoring  gays! Duh, God has given the judgment already, Reiteration being labeled as  judgment is moronic thinking or.."the congenital American optimism that denies conflicts and imagines all stories having happy endings" RJ Samuelson) what law has been made that protects them more than anyone else?