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Who is the Comforter?
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George View Drop Down
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Points: 406 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote George Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 April 2006 at 7:32am

Originally posted by ak_m_f ak_m_f wrote:

[quote]
Muhammad could not fit the role. Remember who Jesus was speaking to when he announced the coming of the Comforter; his disciples. He told his disciples that they knew the Comforter; Jesus' disciples did not know Muhammad.


So If the disciples knew him then he must be long dead because they are dead too, therefore there will be no comforter.
/QUOTE]

This is the Holy Spirit I'm talking about:

"In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.  Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and The Spirit of God was hovering over the waters." (Genesis 1:1-2)

"So Pharaoh asked them, "Can we find anyone like this man, one in whom is The Spirit of God?" Then Pharaoh said to Joseph, "Since God has made all this known to you, there is no one so discerning and wise as you." (Genesis 41:38-39)

"The Lord said to Moses, "Bring Me seventy of Israel's elders who are known to you as leaders and officials among the people. Have them come to The Tent Of Meeting, that they may stand there with you. I will come down and speak with you there, and I will take of The Spirit that is on you and put The Spirit on them. They will help you carry the burden of the people so you will not have to carry it alone." (Numbers 11:16-17)

 

"The woman gave birth to a boy and named him Samson. He grew and The Lord blessed him, and The Spirit of The Lord began to stir him..." (Judges 13:24-25)

 

"The Spirit of The Lord will come upon you [Saul] in power, and you will prophesy with them; and you will be changed into a different person." (1 Samuel 10:6)  

 

"The Spirit of God has made me; the breath of The Almighty gives me life." (Job 33:4)

 

"When you send Your Spirit, they are created, and you renew the face of the earth." (Psalm 104:30)

 

The Comforter, sometimes refered to as "Helper" is identified in the Scriptures as the Holy Spirit by Jesus.

 

Jesus is not talking about a prophet or an angel.  Yes, Jesus' disciples knew the Holy Spirit and his work, but he is not dead.
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HyungMeng View Drop Down
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Points: 1 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HyungMeng Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 April 2006 at 8:59am

Yes, I have likewise heard that Muslims teach that Mohammed was the Paraclete prophesied in the NT.  It's interesting that the Bahai faith people also claim this for Baha'u'allah. 

But a careful reading of Jesus' words indicate that the Paraclete is none other than the Holy Spirit who is God.  Now, Jesus said to baptize in God's Name, which is Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Therefore, it appears that neither Mohammed or Baha'u'allah could be the Paraclete, the Comforter.
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Alibaba View Drop Down
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Christians believe that God is a Trinity of Persons all of equal power, substance and glory.  In the Church of England, this is confirmed by the 39 Articles.  Here is that very article written in Old English:

I. Of fayth in the holy Trinitie.

There is but one lyuyng and true God, euerlastyng, without body, partes, or passions, of infinite power, wysdome, and goodnesse, the maker and preseruer of al things both visible and inuisible. And in vnitie of this Godhead there be three persons, of one substaunce, power, and eternitie, the father, the sonne, and the holy ghost.

I don't know of any Christian Churches that don't believe in the Trinity.  If a sect doesn't believe in the Trinity then how could they be Christian?
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BMZ View Drop Down
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Points: 1852 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 April 2006 at 9:55am

Baba,

The Filipino Christians are the best lot. In their daily life, they just don't talk about God and the Holy Ghost.

They just talk of Jesus only in everything e.g., Jesus will do this, Jesus will do that, Jesus is looking at you, Jesus loves you, Jesus cares for you and Jesus takes care of you and so on.

At least they don't complicate the things at all.  I think other Christians should emulate them and save themselves from all the  hassle and debates on Trinity.

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George View Drop Down
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Originally posted by bmzsp bmzsp wrote:

Baba,

The Filipino Christians are the best lot. In their daily life, they just don't talk about God and the Holy Ghost.

They just talk of Jesus only in everything e.g., Jesus will do this, Jesus will do that, Jesus is looking at you, Jesus loves you, Jesus cares for you and Jesus takes care of you and so on.

At least they don't complicate the things at all.  I think other Christians should emulate them and save themselves from all the  hassle and debates on Trinity.

Very good, BMZ.  Guess the Filipino Christians have cut through the "red tape" that you get yourself so confused by and attribute all to Jesus who they consider God.  Works for me.
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BMZ View Drop Down
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That was exactly my point. You don't need all that red tape. Just say it loud that Jesus is the God Almighty and forget God and the Holy Spirit. You would never need Trinity or a Tri-unity. This is evident from the fact that Jesus never taught trinity. Jesus always maintained God the Most High, very high above himself.

Life will be so easy for Christians when they discuss the One God.

You will be almost at par with the Jews and Muslims but they will still not be recognising Jesus as God or a god.

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George View Drop Down
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Originally posted by bmzsp bmzsp wrote:

That was exactly my point. You don't need all that red tape. Just say it loud that Jesus is the God Almighty and forget God and the Holy Spirit. You would never need Trinity or a Tri-unity. This is evident from the fact that Jesus never taught trinity. Jesus always maintained God the Most High, very high above himself.

BMZ, you are getting another F on your report card.  God Almighty is the Father, the Word (son) and the Holy Spirit.  God revealed himself as triune in nature and he must have thought that we needed to know that.  Jesus taught that there was a Father, a Son, and a Holy Spirit.  He taught that instructions come or proceed from the Father; he taught that the son carries out the instructions; and he taught that God's Holy Spirit is alive and indwelling Christians.  That is enough for me.

Life will be so easy for Christians when they discuss the One God.

Another F on your report card.  There is only one God and we believe in that one God.  Don't ever accuse Christians of believing in more than one God.  Besides it is my experience that Christians rarely discuss the concept of the Trinity, so life is easy for us. 

I think if you stopped thinking that we believe in three gods, life would be easier for you when discussing this subject with Christians.

You will be almost at par with the Jews and Muslims but they will still not be recognising Jesus as God or a god.

There is within Judaism a concept of God working through his word, incarnating his word and practically the same thought as we Christians accept for the role of the Holy Spirit.  It is the Muslims who are out of sync.
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George View Drop Down
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Points: 406 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote George Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 April 2006 at 6:26am

Notice to all.

My topic is getting sidetracked.  Please remember the subject is Who is the Comforter? and not trinity and other stuff.

Please keep in topic.

 

 



Edited by George
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