Nasakh - Sharia - Fiqh |
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Hayfa
Senior Member Female Joined: 07 June 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 2368 |
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To exterminate the cause of a crime does not mean the problem is solved because underneath in our societies there are root causes for behavior and this behavior will not be changed by cutting off hands, stoning people, hanging them or putting them to death by other means this is not justice. Yes there is a root cause.. that may or not be able to be fixed. Take for instance, pedophiles. They go through all the �counseling� you want and they will do it again and again. All of us, if we are able to admit it, can do bad things. None of us are perfect. Look at how humanity behaves over and over.. all over the world. The destruction of each other, the environment and this planet. It is about justice it is also not letting them amok. Then I am being passive. I think humanity actually has a great capacity for goodness but we are so, so forgetful. We do not think about our acts, our actions. We go about our lives mindlessly at times. If we had not lost touch with Allh, our inner-selves and our purpose we may be all better off as living beings on this planet. The thing is people ARE lost. They have lost the ability to live in this world with decency and respect. Yes we should all treat each person well. And at times, it is necessary to do what is best for the majority of the people. Otherwise we are held captive by the bad elements of the society. It is great to think of mercy upon people. But what about society as a collective whole? If people are quite capable of doing heinous and terrible acts what is actually best for society as well as them? Let them wallowing in a prison for life is one answer. Or actually can death be more humane? We tend to have a lot of compassion for those for whom may have to pay the punishment.. But why? We tug at the heart strings. Recently another woman was set on fire by her boyfriend. He poured gasoline on her and set her on fire. She will have the struggle all of her life living with burns and scars all over her face and arms. Burns are terrible to live with. Very, very painful, never mind the expense of the medical care. She should have justice. Compassion is good. But that is up to the individuals. For some reason, beyond our understanding, people can lack this. They can kill, main, and hurt others. They should be stopped.
The average rapist will rape many times before being caught.. imagine all those that could be prevented? Forget counseling.. that is nice and does little. Some people are so dysfunctional it is not fair to spend our limited resources on this. One thing that I have noticed about Islam is that structure and organization are very important. I remember before I became a Moslem in one of my numerous talks with my friend about Islam. I asked him about the structure. The case being the need for separate women and men�s spaces. I said, I have no interest in these men, nor do I engage in unhealthy behavior. I have no trouble being in mixed gender spaces. He said that the rules are for the majority who are �weaker� or need more structure. And he is right. Yes it makes it harder if we need a particular guideline to help me. But others do. As we know psychologically, some people have less ability to be able to think of the consequences. So they do drugs, sleep around etc. (Not even the after-life consequences, but what can happen in this life.) Those people need the structure. Strong rules and discipline are sometimes needed. I used to have a harder time understanding and feeling comfortable with the supposed �rigidness� of Islam. And yet the more you see and process the more things seems so much more logical. In fact cutting off someone�s hand, it could be argued, is more merciful then letting them continuing their bad ways.
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When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi
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ALEH
Guest Group Joined: 28 July 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 26 |
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Alaikoam Salam Brothers and Sisters as I mentioned we have to get at the roots of crime and prevent it from happening in the first place. In the Islam I belong to there are corrective measures not punishments of violence or degredation. We have a higher station than animals and we should behave in a higher manner than seeking vengence. As for predophiles they are treatable but it takes time and the most important issue is prevention of such a condition from developing. I guess my understanding and belief in Islam is a little beyond yours and that is okay, everyone has a right to express Islam ie submission to the will of Allah in thier way.
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Judgement day is born in each moment, a moment to see if we need Education, Counseling or Consultation to meet our challenges with grace and dignity for all. (My favorite surah is 99, 1-8)
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fatima
Moderator Group Joined: 04 August 2005 Status: Offline Points: 979 |
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Bismillah irrahman irrahim Assalamu alaikum You know what sister i thought i would politely ask you to rethink cos maybe you are unaware of some stuff. But please stop posting whatever you are because shaytan is helping you every step of your way. You call yourself a muslim and in the same breath you deny two basic concepts, the truthness of Holy Quran and the judgement day. You saying that Holy Quran and Prophet Muhammad (saw) were for a specific time. Ok, if they were that means their message should be overdated and our time should have gone ahead in knowledge. Now i ask you two questions and you can ask medical research institutes if you want. But if you have any sincerity or comprehnsion you would know and realise the truth when it slaps you on the face. First Question is 'A new born baby why does he/she takes resemblance from mother or father', second Question, 'why do even identical twins have different finger prints'. You are too proud of knowledge, understanding, judgement and God knows what of human being. If you really want to have human rule the world as they please. Why not think sensibly, who's is the rule normaly. The person who owns or runs the particular thing. The day you and your little human friends can themselves manage the gravity, or rain or the rising of the sun, shout out. I am sure Allah swt is far more Mighty and Just to not allow you to run your affairs. Honestly there is a limit to naivity and ignorance or is it just arrogance and stubborness to not accept the truth because it dont suite you? wassalam |
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Say: (O Muhammad) If you love Allah, then follow me, Allah will love you and forgive you your faults, and Allah is Forgiving, MercifuL
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amah
Moderator Group Female Joined: 18 March 2006 Status: Offline Points: 1334 |
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Sister, Would you kindly reply to my last post??? I haven't asked rhetorical questions. Peace |
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Allah is Sufficient as a Walee (Protector) and Allah is Sufficient as a Naseer (Helper).
(Surah An-Nisa, Chapter #4, Verse #45) |
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ALEH
Guest Group Joined: 28 July 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 26 |
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Alaikoam Salam As far as I know technicallly there are some 137 sects of Islam, however if you believe as I do you also add into this the Christian, Jewish, Hindu, Siek and other religions into these sects as they are all expressions of the evolution of Islam and even those with no apperent reiligion still submit to the will of Allah in degrees making them Muslims too. As for your question all is in the hands of Allah He guides whom He will to the right path though in todays world we need a little more effort in finding what the right path is for each of us. The path I or you choose may not be right or suit another. Of course everyone is free to choose as they will however a little help with an Inter Faith Call to an Education, Counseling and Consultation Jihad of which the most important level is the level of learning to be the best person we can be and inspire others to do so also. I guess what I am trying to explain is that there are many ways to be a Muslim and submit to the will of Allah and there are many ways to express our Islam. As for twins with unique finger prints that of course is in the hands of Allah. We are free to explore what Islam means to us and we are free to express our Islam in our way. There is hope sister and brothers and that hope begins with Islam, however some laws do need amending to raise us from the state of animals to a high station that of Gaurdian and Messenger not slayer or torturer that is not of Allah nor does it show His mercy it may have been acceptable 1500 to a 100 years ago but it is not acceptable in this day and age we can resolve our challenges without violence or abusing someone. PS this is an Inter Faith Forum for everyone to express themselves and in my opinion examples of their Islam whether they be Christian, Jewish, Hindu, Seik etc all come under the Umbrella of Islam that does not mean that they will express their Islam the same way you do. We have to accept everyone has a freedom and right to express their Islam in their way and inshallah may it be a good way and may we all be inspired to be good people and set aside anger and vengence for Peace and Prosperity for one and all thus turning us from a blood thirsty, blood letting society into one with grace and dignity for all, a society where people will not want to commit a crime because they have better skills to do more productive things with their time and thus express their Islam in a positive and caring manner inshallah may it be so.. Truth is all religions have their limitations otherwise by now one would think thwe world would be far better than it is, however at the same time yes some revision is needed. By saying that religion needs revision does not neglect the importance it had, has in the world it just means that some laws need to be rewritten so that more people are likely to abide by them and if these laws are preventive and address the issues at the roots or foundations then progress will be made, laws that promote further abuse, torture or exicutions is not going to help us progress. My opinion of course. Salam Anne Marie Elderkin Habibi
Edited by ALEH |
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Judgement day is born in each moment, a moment to see if we need Education, Counseling or Consultation to meet our challenges with grace and dignity for all. (My favorite surah is 99, 1-8)
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Andalus
Moderator Group Joined: 12 October 2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 1187 |
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Assalam Aleikum. She will waste your time like no other. Just as the Quran only sects are master obfuscators, this person will never directly debate or discuss, and she is not here to learn, and will only assert her absurd, and dellusional opinions of our beautiful faith. Rhetorical diatribe, and endless rants about love, consultation jihad, and other nonsensical incoherent diatribe is all you will get out of her. Peraphs the best way to deal with her is to ignore her completly, that way we do not legitimize her views, in her mind, as plausable. Thats all she is looking for: validation through someone trying to have a discussion with her about her loony rambelings.
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A feeling of discouragement when you slip up is a sure sign that you put your faith in deeds. -Ibn 'Ata'llah
http://www.sunnipath.com http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/ http://www.pt-go.com/ |
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ALEH
Guest Group Joined: 28 July 2006 Location: Canada Status: Offline Points: 26 |
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Volume 3, Book 49, Number 857:
********* Volume 3, Book 49, Number 870:
********* Salam Alaikoam Peace be with you Yes I go on about the Inter Faith Call to an Education, Counseling and Consultation Jihad (Jihad means struggle and the first most important level is the level of self, ie learning to be the best person you can be as you submit your will to Allah, God, the Creator) I am well aware of the texts of the Quran and the Hadeath of the Prophet PBUH and considering the state of the world I believe some of the laws need revision and it is not unIslamic to say so. In the call for this Inter Faith ECC Jihad we will sort into groups sorted out and learn the skills I have mentioned many times before and thus help assist people with becoming better people inshallah. This will fullfill Surah 9, 1-8 and also begin to create a Most Great Peace starting at the roots. Inshallah if you or anyone has anger management problems, relationship problems , parenting problems, stress or frustration problems, budgetting problems, career problems then you can join in this great sorting out on your own and work at your own pace to learn the skills you need to give everyone including yourself the grace and dignity they/we deserve. You cannot ignor 10 Billion plus counting Muslims all expressing Islam in their way ie expressing their submission to Allah, God , the Creator I am just hoping we can encourage them there is hope in Islam and that we all do count and we can build a world worth living in. A world where there is peace from the roots up inshallah. Salam Anne Marie Elderkin Habibi
Yusuf Ali: [099:001] When the earth is shaken to her (utmost) convulsion, [099:002] And the earth throws up her burdens (from within), [099:003] And man cries (distressed): 'What is the matter with her?'- [099:004] On that Day will she declare her tidings: [099:005] For that thy Lord will have given her inspiration. [099:006] On that Day will men proceed in companies sorted out, to be shown the deeds that they (had done). [099:007] Then shall anyone who has done an atom's weight of good, see it! [099:008] And anyone who has done an atom's weight of evil, shall see it. Edited by ALEH |
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Judgement day is born in each moment, a moment to see if we need Education, Counseling or Consultation to meet our challenges with grace and dignity for all. (My favorite surah is 99, 1-8)
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Lamplighter
Newbie Joined: 19 July 2006 Location: Indonesia Status: Offline Points: 12 |
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Dear All,
First of all, thank you for your kind responses to my questions, although I see that the discussion has expanded to "opinion" about the Sharia Legal System itself. My conclusion for the questions that I ask is: 1) Sharia Legal System is based on Quran as the first source. 2) All moslem believe in the conception of Nasakh. I need to confirm this because my friend said that the conception of Nasakh is only for Shiah's follower. LL |
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