the Kursi

...And your statement is your proof?

So we shld provide evidence .... to what? ... that you have NOT

Perceived the kursi ... yes someone shld or this is a straight Q.E.D.!

Assalaamu alaikum

Some believe that the secrets and meaning of existence can be found via mathematics. If that were the case the phenomena we call �computers� (ie artificial intelligence) could be perceived to be � God!

For computers do not die (where as human beings do), also of significance is that if the soul (conscience & consciousness) could be reduced to mere numbers, artificial intelligence would be the wisest of entities (here on earth), as computer programmes & sheer numerical capacity, allow (those computers) a greater degree of numerical wizardry (compared to human intellect).

I raise the above point in order to try and help clarify why (I perceive) the phenomena called �intellect� to be merely a man-made (& controlled) product that induces haughtiness.

Here in the UK, the vast majority of subjects one can study at university (college in the USA) are intellectual in content. When a person partakes in such courses, they are not only strengthening the position of those whom created the subjects, but they are also supporting them by accepting their goals, and hence inadvertently helping them, by working toward fulfilling those very same goals!

Higher education hence offers those whom are in (worldly) control, the opportunity to not only review the knowledge students offer them via essays & exams (& hence gain firsthand access to that knowledge, free of cost, & in the fields they seek to master), but the courses also serve to condition those whom partake in them, in part, by means of the intense cramming of (intellectual) knowledge one is required to do, if one is to pass exams.

What astonishes me is that many Muslim�s are duped by this process, and willingly pay � to be �brainwashed�, and give those corrupt forces their time & knowledge, in fields that are un-Islamic!

And why do they do this?

Simple, the shaitan�s offer them a trade � work for & support us, and we will grant you with a substantial wage, and hence anything (worldly) you desire!

I tried to illustrate in my last post (as nadir) within the �expansion of the universe� thread, that true knowledge is not obtained via the intellect, rather it can be found as a result of spiritual perception/penetration (as was the case with all the Prophets {AS}), hence why I sought to discuss issues with someone who had gained spiritual perception (& not intellectual).

I sincerely hope that those whom have (already) acquired intellectual knowledge may use it to enhance Islam, and not to support un-Islamic goals. Insha Allah

midway wrote:   Assalaamu alaikum Some believe that the secrets and meaning of existence can be found via mathematics. If that were the case the phenomena we call �computers� (ie artificial intelligence) could be perceived to be � God!

By dear Bro Midway, this is not a logical deduction. As people have different beleifs why would you restrict yourself only to some speicifics believing in God. I think since its your own perception as you seem to believe in God, so you consider discovery of the meanings of existence would in turn mean discovery of God. This is not a logical view.

For computers do not die (where as human beings do), also of significance is that if the soul (conscience & consciousness) could be reduced to mere numbers, artificial intelligence would be the wisest of entities (here on earth), as computer programmes & sheer numerical capacity, allow (those computers) a greater degree of numerical wizardry (compared to human intellect).

Again, my brother, its human who  has invented the AI, so how can you assert that AI has more intellect than human? Yes, I agree that computers might have more faster computing power with more precise repetition of some algorithim, but that is not intellect. Intellect is more to do with free Will, which is obviously missing in computers or what you say in AI. It is human intellect that invented AI and not the vice versa. So, your basic premise is not correct, therefore needless to comment upon the rest of your post.

I raise the above point in order to try and help clarify why (I perceive) the phenomena called �intellect� to be merely a man-made (& controlled) product that induces haughtiness. Here in the UK, the vast majority of subjects one can study at university (college in the USA) are intellectual in content. When a person partakes in such courses, they are not only strengthening the position of those whom created the subjects, but they are also supporting them by accepting their goals, and hence inadvertently helping them, by working toward fulfilling those very same goals! Higher education hence offers those whom are in (worldly) control, the opportunity to not only review the knowledge students offer them via essays & exams (& hence gain firsthand access to that knowledge, free of cost, & in the fields they seek to master), but the courses also serve to condition those whom partake in them, in part, by means of the intense cramming of (intellectual) knowledge one is required to do, if one is to pass exams. What astonishes me is that many Muslim�s are duped by this process, and willingly pay � to be �brainwashed�, and give those corrupt forces their time & knowledge, in fields that are un-Islamic! And why do they do this?

Physical knowledge is an integral part of the whole truth. Our beloved Prohet has much emphasised on this issue since he knew its importance especially in the context of writing down of Quran and his day to day life style. Even in the battle front, he always appreciated and welcome the wise suggestions of his companions as to what shall be done to over come the enemy. Simple examples are the selection of battle grounds in the three wars and more prominant is the suggestion of Hazrat Salman Farsi to dig a ditch around the city. These all examples provides ample proof for the importance of scientific knowledge in the view of our beloved Prophet Mohammad. Ignoring them or considering worthless is not an Islamic view at all.

Simple, the shaitan�s offer them a trade � work for & support us, and we will grant you with a substantial wage, and hence anything (worldly) you desire!

This is a sham view. Totally, ignorant about Islam.

Assalaamu alaikum wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuhu

Thank you to all those whom have helped me in my time at this forum�

I am leaving now, as I am satisfied that there is no more I can personally do.

I approached your leaders with a gift, however they ignored me, do they already know best!? To me it feels like they are suggesting - �I have chosen individual success, at the cost of Islamic success!�  

I think it has become quite apparent that your (corrupt) leaders vex me, a state of mind I no longer wish to entertain, and hence I am leaving to go rest in predestination. There I will await, to see if your leaders wisely choose the Here-after, ahead of the fleeting life of this world.

I bid you farewell�

& good luck