Love as evil

Salam Qokitty

 
  assalamualaikum gokitty,

 In this beautiful verse of quran, Allah swt mentions the prayer of the righteous people, the people who are conscious about their lord and who intend to do good and make sure that by their acts they dont earn a sin or Allahs displeasure,these people earnestly strive to do good. they would never help anyone in doin acts of evil, for they will have a share in that evil done.
 
 in the verse:"our lord! any whom thou dost admist to the fire, truly thou coverest with shame,and never will wrongdoers find any helpers!", it is said that the wrongdoers will never find helpers, but the wrongdoers can have the other wrongdoers as helpers as long as they have a leave to do evil, ".........truly thou coverest with shame..." but they can never have helpers against Allah, when they are being punished by Him.truly they will b covered with shame n will face all the punishments being helpless!!

May Allah guide us all to righteous path. ameen
 

"Jesus and virgin Mary's statues which are adored and prayed to by my Catholic customers."

 

Catholics do not adore and pray to statues. Get your 'facts' straight Hasan.  That's exactly the same as me seeing you as adoring and worshipping the Ka-ba.

 

That's what it looks like, though I know it's not the reality.

 

You were wrong and in need of correction :-).

That sounds like idolatry indeed, if that is how they pray in their hearts. 

 

It is not Catholicism in its truest sense however. Catholics do not believe that Mary is a goddess, as the Qu'ran seems to imply. Or that she is part of the 'trinity'. Catholics do not 'pray to' Mary as Creator. Nor to other 'saints'. Catholics believe all are the family of God - we are all brothers and sisters. The deceased do not lie in graves till Judgement Day. But are alive as God is, a 'God of the living, not the dead'. You follow Muhammad as a example of how to lead a good and holy life. A life that leads to God. In Catholicism Mary is seen as one who submitted wholly to God's will - her 'fiat' - her complete 'yes' to God, when she is asked by Gabriel to become the Mother of Jesus is whole submission. The 'immaculate heart' of Mary is about a heart 'purified' - cleansed of all attachment to wordly things, �sin� which is separateness from God. She is not attached to the creation above Creator - has a heart that beats for God Alone, the Creator above the Creation - submitting to his will in all things, and so loving all creatures, all creation as God intends it to be loved - with a 'pure heart', an 'immaculate heart'.

 

That is no different to the Muslim who seeks to have a heart utterly willing to submit to God in all things, as its greatest end and good. Jesus said, "those who do the will of My Father in Heaven are my mother, brother, sister." It's all about relationships. Family relationships. And Catholics believe that the 'dead' are not 'dead' - but alive in God.

 

Being perfectly submitted to God's will in 'heaven' - they cannot seek anything but God's will for those on earth. So if a person on earth were to seek their intercession - they are seeking the intercession of one wholly submitted to God's will. "Your will be done on earth as it is in Heaven."

 

Catholics believe that God wishes all the members of the 'family', member of the Body of Christ, help and support each other in all ways. It seems that there are different stages on the spriitual path - and different stages in prayer life. It is true that in the past Catholics were so afraid of the wrath filled, judge God - that they feared approach God for anything. So they turn to the maternal - the mother of Jesus as intercessor. That was very wrong as it could seem to turn people from God - scare them from God, as far as I am concerned, anything that does this is very wrong.

 

I could go on and on and on here Hasan. It's like your own faith and beliefs. I don't understand 99.9% of it - and often, it's like listening to a foreign language, getting to grips with that first - 'fore you can begin to understand what the Muslim believes or does not believe.

 

God is the Creator - Master of all Creation - Lord of the Worlds. We are told to seek God in and through the Creation. Unless God deigns to give us a direct heavenly revelation of some sort. I believe that people praying - what can seem like idolatry - may well indeed be them finding God through the Creation - be it in the emulation of Mumammad, Mary or anyone else. If the heart is sincerely praying to God - even through a �creation� - then isn't God big enough, and good enough to lead that heart and soul ultimately to Himself.  I believe so. I have seen in my own life. I pray to God �through� a �creation� � my self. We must be very careful indeed it seems to me H, how we judge others, and how they do or do not pray. God alone sees the heart and will guide it as God wills.

 

If I were to consider Mary in my prayer life. I'd not pray 'to' Mary, or 'through' Mary. But 'with' Mary in praising God. I do pray TO God though as Creator, as God Alone is Creator.

 

"My soul doth magnify the Lord

My spirit exults in God my saviour.......     " etc

 

I see where you are coming from Hasan, and can see why you'd be concerned. I also see and know too however by what you have said, that you have not made a serious study of Catholic theology. You are judging something without the 'facts'. Same as me judging Muslims, or Islam �cause of the behaviours of certain groups or individuals - without going off and finding out the reality for myself.

 

The only problem with all of that is we only have one short life time. And it would take about fifty thousand at least to read everything written on all of these religions. lol

 

�The last shall be first and the first shall be last�. Mary was least in this world, but raised high in Heaven. The Qu'ran seems to suggest something like this too. But even being raised to the greatest of heights - they retain their humblest origins. It's like God - paradox.

 

There are reported 'apparitions' of Mary thoughout the world over the centuries - coming to call humanity back to God. Guadaluope being one of them. I know there is much controversy over these within Christianity and even Catholicism iteself. I am not saying they are true or not. Just interesting. One is more recent in Yougoslavia. Mary comes to ask people to repentance, prayer, fasting and conversion of heart. To deepen the life of faith and ask it be given to the �unbelievers�.  Prayer for 'unbelievers' is strongly emphasised. One time apparently, the young people who reportedly 'see' Mary, are asked by her to fast two days a week. God wishes people to fast as a healthy spiritual discipline.  They ask her about this. It is said that Mary looks towards a  Muslim woman in the crowd and says, "if she can do it, so can you." Another time they ask her who is the 'holiest' person in the village at a given time. Apparently Mary points to a little Muslim woman in the group assembled and speaks about her humilty being more pleasing to God than that of any other there at that time.

 

I dunno about the reality/truth of any of this. But God is bigger than all of us and our perceptions - and even our 'religions' I am sure.

 

I just feel it is presumption indeed - pride,  that leads us to a place where we feel we have any right to judge the state of a heart/soul before its Creator. I could tell you Hasan that your description of prayer sounds to me like you pray to a big Nothing. Just what it might SEEM like, not the reality.

 

 

I had a letter from a friend in South Africa this morning. He is a 'born again' Evangelical Christian. To the core. Great man don't get me wrong, and does brilliant work with young people who've been seriously damaged in life. He and I had a few battles over what it may or may not mean to 'pray', 'worship', 'adore' and love God. Like you - he saw Catholics as 'born again' pagan idolators. All I said to him was that he had no right to judge the heart of any human being, and presume to know the relationship that person may or may not have had with the Creator.  We sat last month and just chatted. I told him what Christianity meant for me � what Christ meant for me and what I was raised to believe, whether I now believed it or not. He never opened his mouth.

 

My friend wrote this to me. He is at home in SA for a holiday:

 

"Love driving around the mountain and just chilling out - sunsets are
beautiful, almost spiritual; I could sense God's greatness and power
so easily

I have also adopted a much more flexible and tolerant approach in
terms of one's relationship with God - I have realised that I am not
able to judge at all - everyone has a unique connection with God in
his / her own way - a connection I would not be able to understand."

 

We�re all ignorant of so many things, things known to God Alone. I just feel we need to be careful how we judge others, intentionally or not.  ï¿½The road to hell is paved with good intentions.� 

 

God bless Hasan

 

I don�t know what�s true or not. Just have to �resign� it all to �God�s will� so much of the time.