Chrysalis:
Ridiculous. There is a difference b/w people who surrounded the
Prophet physically, and those that were his circle of trust. I was clearly
referring to the sahaba he trusted, and loved. And it is those sahaba that
we take religion from.
The prophet has given all necessary criteria. Unfortunately, many of
those whom you think were beloved of the prophet were actually not. This can be
understood in so many different confirming ways if one ponders and investigates
Quran and history of Islam with deep hindsight. For instance, one who gives
authority of governing Muslim society to one whose father used to hate Mohammad
(sawa) and whose son eventually kills the beloved grandson of the prophet can
by no means be the beloved of the prophet (sawa).
Another example: For everyone who has studied Islamic history it is more
than Mutevater and there is no doubt that the prophet used to say Fatima (sa)
is part of him and whoever makes her angry makes the prophet angry and whoever
hurts her hurts the prophet (sawa). On the other hand, it is also more than
Mutevater that after the death of the prophet (sawa) Fatima (sa) was angry with
Abu Bakr and was alive only 6 months after the prophet and never spoke to Abu
Bakr till she died. One can never say that Mohammad (sawa) loves all companions
if they honestly study what has happened.
And it is those sahaba that we take religion from. . . rather than
restrict our religion to a favoured, rare few (not to mention imaginery,
ordinary, error prone Imams, who will 'come' ages and ages AFTER Prophet
Muhamamad perfected Islam)
It seems you misunderstood me. I will talk about 12 Imams but before
that regarding the question �After the prophet from whom should we take our
religion?� the answer is already given by the prophet. We are not to answer
this question because the prophet has already done it perfectly and completely.
Whatever criterion the prophet has given is crucial not whatever we imagine.
Also, do not think that you are taking your religion from original
companions. Who has taught you Sahih Bukhari is the most authentic hadith book?
Those sahabah or prone Imams ages after the prophet?!!!
Just to let you know, the author of Sahih Bukhari was living after 9 or
10 infallible Imams of 12.
So the 12 imams that will eventually come into this world, as
ordinary human biengs, are better Muslims than the Prophet's wives and his
trusted companions? Your loyalty and trust is misplaced my friend, grossly.
Ordinary human beings? All of them are infallible human beings not
ordinary. Furthermore, they have already come. The first three of them are
Ali(as), Hasan(as) and Husain(as). The rest are from progeny of Husain (as).
All of them are already born and the last one is Mahdi (as) who is alive, who
will eventually come and Isa Massih (as) will also come with him and pray
behind him.
The misplacement here is that you take your religion from fallible people
and suppose infallible guiders as ordinary people ignoring them. This is the
gross misplacement Chrysalis.
We do not love anyone that Prophet Muhammad never loved. And we
love everyone whom he loved (Abu Bakr, Umar, Usman, Ali, Fatima, Aisha, Hassan,
Hussain (R.A) inclusive) There is a difference b/w these Sahaba, and just
any random bedoiun/nonmuslim the Prophet may have seen/met/been with (like u
suggest)
From the ones you proposed I only love Ali(as), Fatima(as), Hassan(as)
and Hussain(as) and the rest is the 9 Imams from Hussain (as) I talked about.
They are not random. Mohammad (sawa) has mentioned all of them till Mahdi (as)
and has said that Mahdi (as) is from his line and among his progeny. There has
not been any randomness from the first day.
This is a typical response the Shia give, when we talk about
Prophet Muhammad's Companions and his wives. Apparently, according to you guys,
they are to be equated with Munafiqeen? Aazubillah.
Actually this was not what I talked about in my last post. I mentioned
the example of Munafighin as a support of my talk to stress that physical being
with the prophet does not necessitate righteousness. In fact, I do not need to
judge who was a Monafigh and who was not. What I know for sure is that among
wives none of them was infallible and was said by the prophet to be followed
and unfortunately some of the companions made great mistakes and only those of
them who never ignored or forgot the words and wills of Mohammad (sawa)
regarding AhlulBayt and Ali (as) stayed non-deviated.
You are suggesting just like Asda, that Prophet Muhamamd
nauzubillah had bad judgement, and he married women that were nauzubillah bad
muslims, and Allah let him make them Umhat-ul-Momineen.
I am not suggesting what you said. The prophet Mohammad (sawa) in his
recitation, saying, and acting completed whatever people had to know.
Therefore, there is no room to escape from responsibility. Judgment will be
done on the Day of Judgment by Allah (SWT).
Where the prophet said that we should follow and take our religion from
his wives?
Did or did not Prophet Muhamamd have good judgement of people?
As I said the prophet completed what he was supposed to complete by
Allah�s will.
Was he not infallible? If he was, then why would he make an error
in judging not only one, but several of his beloved companions?
The prophet was infallible and never made any error. He gave the
absolute right criteria for after himself. One who does not deceive him/herself
would understand the truth. He perfectly introduced infallible Ahlul-Bayt to
people. He did not need to judge the Ummah and companions one by one nor did
Allah tell him to do so otherwise it would be the Day of Judgment not the
freewill and test in this world. Instead of that, Allah (SWT) ordered him to
make people know the real guiders for after him and he did it completely. That
was what people need to know and he completed it.
Was not Allah responsible in correcting Prophet Muhammad if he
nazubillah committed a mistake?
As I said the prophet exactly did what Allah wanted him to do without
one moment of deviation.
Would Allah let 'evil' 'munafiq' people influence the Prophet?
No body influenced the prophet and no body could stop him from what
Allah wanted him to do and say.
Trust in Allah and His judgement, and His Prophet's judgement, and
accept the facts. . .
Thanks Chrysalis. Alhamdolellah, What I say in
my posts are with full trust in Allah and his prophet. I honestly say my
reasoning provided with evidences. There is no enforcement in belief system and
we have freewill in this regard. Now you may say �To you be your Way, and to me
mine�. I would accept it and we will wait till the day on which everything will
be clear.
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