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Topic ClosedGay muslims?
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Saladin View Drop Down
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Points: 575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 December 2009 at 5:43am
Originally posted by Gibbs Gibbs wrote:

Just like I can ask how can anyone believe in Noah's Ark and God putting every creature in a boat which, according to Biblical measurements would be impossible since there are billions of species of small creatures?
 
Muslims dont believe the whole world got flooded during Noah's time or that he took with him a pair of every species in the world.
 
Originally posted by Gibbs Gibbs wrote:

Or how can anyone believe in a deity that we can't see??
 
By reasoning.
 
Originally posted by Gibbs Gibbs wrote:

Or a prophet whom which there is no physical proof?
 
By learning from his legacy.
 
 
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'
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Points: 575 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 December 2009 at 6:26am
Originally posted by Gibbs Gibbs wrote:

I can't wait til the old dogmatic farts that run the three faiths die off and allow tolerance of homosexuality cause quite frankly I don't think God cares who you sleep with but, if you are a decent human being
 
The World would do a lot better without the libertine bums! And dont try to think for God - you cant! Do you even believe in God? Its not God, its you amigo, who dont care who sleeps with whoever! You're wasting your time if you wanna promote your morally bankrupt beliefs here. Why waste my time on you...
 
Whoever wants an Islamic perspective on homosexuality, visit http://gaymuslims.org.
 
Whoever wants to promote sodomised propaganda here - sorry!... wrong number. Dont waste your time and importantly other people's time here. No amount of sophistry and inane ramblings' gonna change the fact that homosexual lifestyle is harmful to the individual and society and there's no place for this in Islam. Go boogie in some queer forums....
 
 
'Trust everyone but not the devil in them'
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Points: 292 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 December 2009 at 7:13am
Originally posted by Gibbs Gibbs wrote:

I second the above. I think one can argue that religious fanaticism which we see in the world today is a sickness of the soul. There are gays of all religious creed. There were gays during Muhammad's time (I'm willing to bet even among the crowd during his reign). Gays just don't exist in the U.S as some would think. Its funny I just recently read about the history of the Ottoman jannisary. This group was made up of young slave boys of christian faith whom would personally guard the sultan as well as fight. Yet it was said that these young boys would accompany the sultan in his personal quarters....hmm sounds like some sickness there
 
Obviously the janissaries were allowed there because they were the guards of the sultans, just give it a break with your ottoman and Muslim bashing loser, stop winging you got your ass whopped and move on. Anyway, its funny claims of the sultans committing such acts usually comes from orientalist homos themselves. You Europeans love fantasizing about things that are unseen, like presuming harems were orgy spots etc.

Mind you, the Janissaries were the most extreme faction in the empire, your modern day �extremists�, not to mention the fact that the sultans had plenty of your European women in there chambers to have fun with, it can be upsetting being done by Muslims, but that is life.

Oh and this has nothing to do with us Muslims being intorelent, Allah forbids us to do such acts, meaning we act against or at least show a stance against what is wrong, dont take in personally against youTongue

Your  constant Islam bashing is getting ridiculous, you should tone it down abit and stop throwing mud at Muslims every opportunity you get. Someone being gay or not does not concern us, but trying to reform religion so it suits everyones needs, from gays to secularists does, as it clearly contradicts Islam and is a big sin. Im surprised you dont show the same level of support for those �extremist�  whom likes of you puke hate about.



Edited by SteppeNomad - 25 December 2009 at 7:14am
Ya Allah, Bismillah, AllahuAkbar.
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Points: 939 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 December 2009 at 12:19pm
So my difference of opinion is islam bashing? Where in my posts have I directly insulted islam? If you take my comment of gays being among Muslim as something disrespectful then you ought to get over it. The comment regarding the sultan and the jannissaries was in relation to Sign Readers comment on "sickness" of the soul.

I agree, being gay and devoutly religious is seemingly a contradiction. However I believe irrespective of that reality we all define our reality for ourselves. So for the jew or muslim that believes in God or whatever and uses their reason to believe is how they define their reality. I'm not telling anyone to accept homosexuality I'm just posing an alternative. I'm married with kids (and not in the closet) I just see a different side of life.

Steppe Nomad I'm not sure I understand your comment on how I got my ass whooped. I've never got my ass whooped by an imperial army so come again?
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Hayfa View Drop Down
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Points: 2368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 December 2009 at 12:54pm
I can't wait til the old dogmatic farts that run the three faiths die off and allow tolerance of homosexuality cause quite frankly I don't think God cares who you sleep with but, if you are a decent human being


old dogmatic farts.. what about the ones younger than you??? I think it is not accepted by the vast majority of humans except in pockets like western cities etc. It may exist in other places but it is not at all accepted by the majority of people.

You know from my observations I have come to believe that a good portion of people who claim to be 'gay' do so as a rejection of either society or of a particular person or group. It amazed me how many people I knew back in the day- a while ago who said they were 'lesbian' who are now married to men.  I believe many women who are 'gay' reject the objectification of women and thus men. It just seems easier and safer. No one wants to be a 'piece of meat' so to speak. And the gay men I have met, had very odd views of women. It was downright creepy to be around.

And if someone has 'desires' we live a life to control them. So say I go to the store and want to buy something. Even with credit, unless I can afford I am not to buy it. And just because one has 'desires' does not mean that I should act on them. Nor should society say they are acceptable.

And its not about what 'someone does in the bedroom.' Yes there has been deviant behavior throughout history. The difference is that people want acceptance. If the behavior is repugnant why should they say "great let's party!"?

I think it ties into the difference with sexuality becoming public and open. Debasement of people in general is the norm. There is little dignity left. Islam has no problem with great sex within bounds. But it is and will be a private matter. If two people of the same sax act in such a matter. God will judge. But that does not mean Muslims should say it is normative behavior. It is not.  


Edited by Hayfa - 25 December 2009 at 12:55pm
When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi
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Points: 939 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 December 2009 at 4:56pm
Well the problem in your response hayfa is the openness of homosexuality versus the existence of homosexuality and no I disagree about majority of people. Unless you know 6.4 billion humans I doubt you know even a fraction of the majority. When referring to majority you are only referring to those of a monotheistic or religious background.

When I refer to the "old farts" I'm referring to the fanatical priests, rabbis, imams that spew hatred. To challenge your view hayfa what of transgendered? Which is the belief that a person feels they are the wrong gender. So what if a biologically born man who is muslim, has an emotional, spiritual, and sexual attraction towards men yet inside he feels like a woman what then?

Before you call him crazy my wife says that there is not enough proof that it is biological, psychological, or social. There are many oddities in human beings and just because those behaviors are opposed to the normative attitudes in our respective society doesn't mean they are grossly abhorrent. "God forbid" anyone of you needs emergency surgery from a gay physician. I hope he or she doesn't have "gay cuddies"
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Points: 939 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 December 2009 at 4:59pm
In addition there is no "pockets of western countries" most of europe, parts of south america, U.S. Colonies (hawaii) are very accepting to gays and their rights don't differentiate from hetero couples.
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Points: 2368 		Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 December 2009 at 1:46pm
Hi Gibbs,

Transgendered people do exist. And there are people born with both sex organs. It happens. But it is not that common. But its no one's issue if someone has a medical condition. That is why they often have surgery to correct it.

Pockets: where do you live. If you go between the west coast cities and east coast cities it is NOT accepted. No people are bot out killing people but they are not happy.  South America.... please have you been there.. .been there... Minus is some cities.. tell me where its accepted??? The majority of people don't accept it as non deviant.   And as Pati can attest in Spain.. its a vocal minority...

And as I said its about public and private...  Frankly really if people really check themselves... Thinking about what men do to each other..ummm well they say the 'correct' line of political correctness. But the thought well..

I don't care if someone is gay.. I think alot of people should just put sex back in the privacy of their homes. I don't need it from gay or straight people. lol
When you do things from your soul, you feel a river moving in you, a joy. Rumi
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