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Gabriel: "Read" or "Recite?"

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George View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote George Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2006 at 8:34am
Originally posted by bmzsp bmzsp wrote:

George,

Thanks for saying: "We know that Jesus wrote in the dirt during the stoning incident.  We know that Jesus could read because he read the Scriptures out loud from the scrolls.

We also know that Jesus helped Joseph in the family business, so I would say that there is a good chance that Jesus could write."

Has anyone got a small little piece or even an inch-square papyrus of Jesus' own wriitng? Were there any scribes with Jesus when he was delivering sermons and speeches?

I am really shocked that none of his loving disciples or followers kept a piece of any writing done by him. I thought James might have kept some writings of his dear brother.

Thanks

We don't know that they didn't keep little scraps of whatever Jesus wrote or if he wrote.  They would be long gone by now.

I am really shocked that the Muslims didn't keep any scraps of what Muhammad wrote; even if it was an X.  I am also shocked that the Qur'an that his daughter used was destroyed.

The world is full of shocking thing. LOL

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George View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote George Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2006 at 8:37am

BMZ:

You posted:

Did Gabriel ask the Prophet of Islam to read or recite when Gabriel first encountered Muhammad in the cave?

It's just not your day, George!

You wrote: "I don't understand what all the fuss is about.  What difference does it make whether Muhammad could read or write or not?"

You started the thread, George!

And my response is:  Yes, I started the thread and I am asking another related question.

I am having a great day!!!



Edited by George
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BMZ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2006 at 8:45am

"I am really shocked that the Muslims didn't keep any scraps of what Muhammad wrote; even if it was an X.  I am also shocked that the Qur'an that his daughter used was destroyed."

There you get the answer. He did not even know how to write an X.

I am also very shocked to hear that: "the Qur'aan that his daughter used was destroyed."  Her "Qur'aan" was her living father, the Prophet.  There was no compiled Qur'aan in the form of a book when she was alive.  She died within six months after her father's death. I think she was only 19 when she passed away.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote George Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2006 at 11:55am

BMZ, please follow the dots:

 

Dot One:  From Mishmish

 

"In the instances of the Hadith you site, the Prophet(PBUH) was sending letters to the leaders of neighboring countries, getting married, etc... all that would have been sufficient would have been His mark, or signature.  The Hadiths do not state that the Prophet(PBUH) wrote a manuscript or novel."

 

Dot Two:  From George

"I am really shocked that the Muslims didn't keep any scraps of what Muhammad wrote; even if it was an X."  I was picking up on what Mishmish said.  Muhammad "wrote" letters.  Obviously, if he couldn't write, he would have a secretary write the letters, but he did make his mark.  BMZ, Muhammad was a very intelligent man and I am sure that he could understand the principle of making a mark on his letters to make them authentic.

Dot Three:  From BMZ

There you get the answer. He did not even know how to write an X.

Apparently someone (Mishmish and those who wrote the Hadiths)  thinks that your prophet could write a "X" on documents and letters.

From George:

"I am also shocked that the Qur'an that his daughter used was destroyed."

From BMZ:

"I am also very shocked to hear that: "the Qur'aan that his daughter used was destroyed."  Her "Qur'aan" was her living father, the Prophet.  There was no compiled Qur'aan in the form of a book when she was alive.  She died within six months after her father's death. I think she was only 19 when she passed away."

From George: I was speaking of Hafsa's Qur'anic documents, whether daughter, wife or whomever.

 

If I were a Muslim it would not bother me if my prophet could read or write.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 May 2006 at 9:42pm

George,

From George: I was speaking of Hafsa's Qur'anic documents, whether daughter, wife or whomever.

 

You should get the facts right before you write. You are now speaking of Hafsa. Writing "whether daughter, wife or whomever" is not in a good taste.

 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote George Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2006 at 6:19am
Originally posted by bmzsp bmzsp wrote:

George,

From George: I was speaking of Hafsa's Qur'anic documents, whether daughter, wife or whomever.

 

You should get the facts right before you write. You are now speaking of Hafsa. Writing "whether daughter, wife or whomever" is not in a good taste.

 

If I have offended you, then I apologize, but at least you know now what I am referring to.  :)

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BMZ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2006 at 8:43am

Thanks, George.  

Good Night

BMZ

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Mishmish Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07 May 2006 at 11:25am

Assalamu Alaikum:

The Prophet(PBUH) put his mark on the letters by using a wax and his ring, which was engraved: Mohammed Messenger of Allah. The letters he sent were written at his behest, not by him.

The Quran states quite clearly that the Prophet was unlettered. At least he was alive at the time and able to dictate what should be written to his companions and the people around him, so that years after his death things would not be written that take on mystical proportions and turn him into something he was not....

 



Edited by Mishmish
It is only with the heart that one can see clearly, what is essential is invisible to the eye. (The Little Prince)
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