The Qur’an II

Firewall :  I love you truly! You are terrific! Excellent! Superb! Because you have just quoted the verse that I was searching for : the verse that states that the Christian God and the Muslim God are the same !!

Now I am closer to my goal : to find a relation, a connection,  between the Qur'an and the Bible ! And that verse did that ! So my rationale that it is the same God speaks to the Christians and Moslems, has been confirmed by the Qur'an, which is, after all, God's word itself.

I knew I will not find it in the Bible, because God's word in the Bible preceded God's word in the Qur'an !

So I think it is becoming more clear now that the tree of Christianity and the tree of Islam  has the same main trunk; the leaves [= daily rule and regulations] are mostly all the same, as we know already. The 2 main branches are apparently Christianity and Islam.

Thank you from the bottom of my heart !

Now here I have some other questions. Intended also for any one else reading this. In the following Qur'anic verses [which I am not quoting here to keep the psoting short]  from a translation by Moh . M.Picktall, the word 'Spirit" and "our Spirit" is mentioned.

Verses : 2:87 ; 2:253 ; 5:110 ; 17: 85 ; 21:91. [There must be more verses, I haven't read them yet.]

From my own logic and from the context of the verses, I conclude that what is meant is 'God's Spirit' ? Am I correct?

If I am correct, then Islam does recognise the manifestation of God in his Spirit ? In other words the "duality" of God's being ?

If I am wrong, how should we understand the words "Spirit" and "our Spirit" exactly?

Best wishes,

Tom.--

Firewall:  You are truly good! Thanks for your clarifications on the meaning of "holy Spirit" in those verses. So in those verses in the Qur'an that I quoted "holy Spirit" is meant the angel Gabriel.  But, is it explicitly stated in other verses in the Qur'an, or is it just implicitly understood?

And, I must correct the impression that I made with using the term "duality" - which in fact in my posting I have already put between quotations marks.  No I didn't mean to describe that God is 2. No, I was thinking in our Biblical terms, where "Holy Spirit" means the Spirit of God, also termed the "Holy Ghost", and one of the functions of the Trinity, but God is One. And I have always understood that Islam believes just in One God.

Quoting you:  " I find it nice you're looking into a connection between the religions. for muslims, we believe it already. it's the basic of our faith.", I was a little puzzled. What do you mean exactly by it?

And, I appreciate your comments very much, but cannot follow the thread of it. I know that the basic of your faith is One God. So we XChristians believe in One and Only God. Do you perhaps have the opinion that we Christians in 3 Gods? That the Trinity we believe in is 3 gods? No, we believe only in One God, already 600 years before the Prophet was born, and since Adam -- some several thousand years in addition.

In this connection and the references of Dr M Hilali that you quoted, my comments are:

The verses quoted of the book of John on the coming Counselor and Comforter, must be read in its whole context, and not only partially. So you have to read John 14: 15 to 20[not only 15 and 16]; and John 15 : 26-27 and John 16: 5-8 and John 16: 12-14 in the context of the whole chapter John 16. If you don't,  then you will easily get misled.

These verses are -- among others -- the fundaments of the Trinity concept ! In these verses, to be read contextually as a whole, Jesus clearly explains that He is the Son of God and that after his death and resurrection, a Counselor and Comforter will come to help mankind in his daily life : the Holy Spirit who is God and Jesus himself, the Father and Son himself. And all three is the Trinity. It is not ARE the trinity, but IS the Trinity.

I am not going to elaborate further on this here, because in this thread I hope to discuss the Qur'an. But if you like to know more of the Trinity concept,  we can discuss that in another thread, or directly by email.

But I am really happy to be able to discuss all this with you Firewall, especially the very mature way you are responding, without unnecessary emotions, frequently spewed by so many others which lead to nowhere and  only shut the door of communications.

I am just very glad, that I can find a true connection between the Bible and the Qur'an from our discussions.

Perhaps you can give your views and comments on my very, very, first and initial question of this topic which up until now I haven't got an reasonable and acceptable answer: 

"What and how is the connection between the the similar stories, events, figures and characters in the Qur'an and the Bible. How should we see them? In particular because the Christians knew them already for 600 years before the birth of the Prophet Mohammad [PBUH] ?

Thanks a lot, and best wishes.

Tom.-

Firewall: 

1] My question concerning the similar stories of the Qur'an and the Bible is just : Why is it similar?

The logic of the 2 facts is that the preceding stories are the original writings? Is this conclusion true?

2] Yes, definitely yes that the Jews can claim that from the Christians, but we, but we recognise that as the word of God, and also as part of the Bible.

 3] Then my question would be now: do Islam recognises the Bible as the word of God? It surely doesn't consider the Bible as part of the Qur'an?

4]  Thanks for the quotes from the Qur'an. But frankly I can't grasp the meaning of those 2 verses you quoted:  2: 135-136 and 3:65 ?

In what context is  2: 135-136 intended?

And in 3:65, what was really argued about Abraham?

5]  You know who said that in  John 16 : 13-14 ? It was Jesus himself speaking of the Holy Ghost which will come after Jesus has gone to  Heaven [, which was later confimed in Acts]. And those verses are part of most of John which explains clearly the Trinity. The  Comforter and Counselor mentioned there in some verses is the Holy Spirit, and none other.

You have to read the verses in context, not out of context. So read John from chapter 1, to understand John 16. It is a totally integrated and unseparable story of the Trinity.

Sure it fits the description of the Prophet, why not, but is then out of context. It isn't that easy. A paraphrase in the book "War and Peace" could easily fit a character in the book of "Gone with the Wind" but is then out of context. I hope you get my point.

Thanks, best wishes. Especially for the coming fasting month. God bless.

Tom.-

1] Will you be so kind to quote the verses that tell about Jesus' coming and defeat Dajjal? Is there a certain time frame mentioned, or, the signs of his coming?

Well, I did a search for Dajjal and here is what I found:

Who is the evil Dajjal (the "anti-Christ")?
by Mohammed Ali Ibn Zubair Ali 

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Note: Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wassallam) has exhorted the regular recital of Suratul Kahf which will most certainly save one from the Evils of Dajjal.

Hadhrat Imraan bin Husain (R.A.) relates that, "I heard Rasulullah (Salallahu Alayhi Wasallam) saying: "Since the birth of Adam (A.S.) till the advent of Qiyamah there is no fitnah (evil, test) much greater that of Dajjal."

 Hadhrat Huzaifah (R.A.) says, Dajjal will be blind in his left eye. He will have very thick hair on his body and he will also have his own type of Jannat (Heaven) and Jahannam (Hell) with him: Although his Jannat will appear as Jannat, in reality it will be Jahannam and likewise though his Jahannam will appear to be Jahannam, in reality it will be Jannat.
(Hadith: Muslim)

 Imraan bin Husain (R.A.) says Rasulullah (Salallahu Alayhi Wasallam) said: "Those who hear about Dajjal should stay far from him. By Allah! A person will approach him thinking him to be a Believer, but on seeing his amazing feats he will become his follower."

 Ubadah bin Saamit (R.A.) once said, "I have explained Dajjal to you but I fear that you might not have understood. Maseeh Dajjal will be short, and his legs will be crooked. The hair on his head will be extremely twisted. He will have one eye (with which he can see, and this is the protruding eye about which other ahadeeth inform us) while his other eye will be totally flat. It will neither be deep (in its socket) nor protruding.

 If you still have any doubt regarding him then remember that your Sustainer (Rabb) is not one-eyed. (Because Dajjal will eventually claim to be Allah). In a lengthy Hadith narrated by Abu Saeed (R.A.), Rasulullah (Salallahu Alayhi Wasallam) is reported to have said: "Dajjal will come but it will be prohibited and impossible for him to enter Madina. He will set up camp in a barren land outside Madina. One person who will be the best of persons will confront him by saying: "I bear witness that you are the very Dajjal about whom Rasulullah (Salallahu Alayhi Wasallam) has informed us."

Dajjal will say to his followers, "If I kill this person and then revive him, you people will still doubt me?"

 They will reply, "No."

 He will then kill this person, (according to another narration he will split this person in two) and thereafter revive him. This person will say, "I am totally convinced more than ever before that you definitely are Dajjal."

 Dajjal will attempt to kill this person again but his efforts will now be in vain.

 (According to a hadith, after this incident, Dajjal will not be able to harm anyone.)

 Hadhrat Anas (R.A.) says that Rasulullah (Salallahu Alayhi Wasallam) said: "Dajjal will come and finally reach the outskirts of Madina. There will be three tremors. At that time, all the disbelievers and hypocrites will flee (from Madina).

 In this way Madina Munawwarah will be purified of all the evil hypocrites.

 Hadhrat Asma bint Yazeed (R.A.) narrates that Rasulullah (Salallahu Alayhi Wasallam) once came to my house and there he spoke about Dajjal. He said that before the emergence of Dajjal there will be three spells of drought. In one year the skies will withold one third of its rains, causing the earth to withold one third of its produce. In the second year the skies will withold two thirds of its rains, causing the earth to withold two thirds of its produce. In the third year, the skies will withold all its water and there will be no crops that year. All animals, be they hooved or toothed, will die as a result. The greatest evil of Dajjall will be to approach anyone and ask him: "If I bring your camel back to life, will you then believe that I am your Rabb?"

 This person will reply, "Most certainly."

 Thereafter Shaytaan (from the many Shayateen who will always accompany Dajjal) will appear before this person in the form of his camel with a fat hump and fully laden udders.

 Likewise Dajjal will appear before another person whose father and brother have long passed away and ask him, "If I bring your father and brother back to life will you believe that I am your Rabb?"

 This person will reply, "Why not?"

 Shaytaan will once again take on the appearance of his brother and father...
(Ahmad)

 Hadhrat Mughira ibn Shu'ba (R.A.) says that, "No one asked Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wassallam) about Dajjal as much as myself. Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wassallam) said to me, "How can he possibly harm you?"

I said: "People are saying that he will have with him a mountain of bread (provisions) and a river of water."

 Rasulullah (Sallallahu Alayhi Wassallam) said: "In the sight of Allah he is much more disgraced than that. (i.e. Allah knows full well that in reality Dajjal has nothing with him, and all that which appears to be with him is but deception). (Bukhari and Muslim).

 Other Ahadeeth regarding Dajjal inform us that:

He will emerge between Shaam and Iraq, and his emergence will become known when he is in Isfahaan at a place called Yahudea.
The Yahudis (Jews) of Isfahaan will be his main followers.
Apart from having mainly Yahudi followers, he will have a great number of women followers as well.
He will have with him fire and water, but in reality the fire will be cold water while that what appears to be cold water will in reality be a blazing fire.
Those who obey him will enter "his Jannat" while those who disobey him will enter "his Jahannam."
There will be a thick fingernail-like object in his left eye.
The letters "Kaa" "Faa" "Raa" will appear on his forehead and will be deciphered by all Mu'mineen regardless of them being literate or not.
He will have a wheatish complexion.
He will travel at great speeds and his means of conveyance will be a gigantic mule. It is said that he will play beautiful music which will attract the music lovers.
Dajjal will lay claim to prophethood.
He will then lay claim to Divinity.
He will perform unusual feats.
He will travel the entire world. He will send down rains upon those who believe in him, which in turn will cause good crops to grow, trees to bear fruit and cattle to grow fat.
He will cause drought to those who disbelieve in him, resulting in starvation and hardship for them.
During those trying times the Mu'mineen will satiate their hunger through the recitation of Subhanallah and La'ilaha Ilallahu.
The hidden treasures will spill forth at his command. He will stay on this Earth for a period of forty days; the length of the first day will be one year, the second day will be equal to one month, the third day will be equal to a week and the remaining days will be normal.
He will be unable to enter Makkah because the Malaikah will be guarding the Holy City and nor will he be able to enter Madina because there will be Malaikah guarding each of the seven entrances to Madina; From Madina he will proceed towards Shaam where Imaam Mahdi will be stationed.
Finally Isa (A.S.) will descend from the heavens and pursue him and eventually kill him at present day Lydda (Baad Lud).

from: "Signs of Qiyamah"
by Mohammed Ali Ibn Zubair Ali  

DAJJAL-THE ANTI CHRIST

I would like to inform you all of some information I have come across and feel that I must share it with all and hope and pray that we all learn a lesson from this. INSHAALLAH.

You will have heard much about DAJJAL - THE ANTI-CHRIST the Anti-Christ from the Christian and Jewish authorities. But what did The Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) say about DAJJAL (The greatest Fitnah (Evil, test)) that will ever befall mankind.

When shall DAJJAL appear? Most of the signs prevalent before the coming of DAJJAL can now be observed. One thing though is for certain, if you are fortunate enough not to witness the Anti-Christ, then your children certainly shall. Before the Anti-Christ shall appear we have been told there shall be a SYSTEM, a DAJJAL- system, that is up and running, that shall await his arrival. This DAJJAL-system, will be the most evil and most corrupt satanic, kaafir force in history.

This system shall promote mass immorality (Homosexuality, Adultery, Fornication), Atheism, Devil-worship, use of USURY, Intoxication, (Alcohol & Drug abuse), Crime, Injustice, Oppression, Fitnah of the Pen (Pornography magazines etc.), cause wars, Famine, Massacres, Rape and suffering on an immeasurable scale.

The DAJJAL-system is of course as we know is FREEMASONRY Every single position in the United Nations, The EEC and every position in the British Parliament is held by people who are Freemasons. Freemasonry has something in the region of 700,000 members in England and Wales, yet the British public hardly know anything about them. Freemasons secretly worship a Devil-God, known as JAHBULON, If you do not believe me (see pages 230-240 of the International best selling book on Freemasonry �The Brotherhood�, by Stephen Knight & �Satanic Voices�, by David M Pidcock).

The Jews, the Christians, the Atheists and Secularist, the Munafiqeen, the whole of Kuffaar shall fall under the banner of the Anti-Christ, against Islam. It may also surprise you to know that all Christian Organizations are Masonic Institutions. About 60% of the Archbishops are Freemasons and secretly practice Devil-worship (see above mentioned books). If you want to know if a church is being used as a Masonic-Temple, then look on the stained glass windows for a Masonic symbol such as �a snake and a dagger, or a star of David �. If the church is in the shape of a Greek Temple, then it is definitely used for Masonic purposes. In Liverpool, the Roman Catholic cathedral has many Pyramids, Masonic symbols. There may be much fear about DAJJAL, but the final victory has been promised to the Muslims. Whereby every single Jew/Freemason shall be put to death. The whole Earth shall be cleansed of Kuffaar once and for all.

Imraan Bin Hussain (RA) relates that I heard Prophet (SAWS) saying : �That since the birth of Adam (AS) till the advent of Qiyamah (Judgement day), there is no Fitnah (Evil, test) much greater than that of DAJJAL� (MUSLIM).

DAJJAL will emerge from a place between Syria and Iraq, and his emergence will become known when he is in Isfahaan at a place called Judea (Yahudea). He will be of Jewish origin. He will have caused his Jewish parents much distress and pain. The Jews will accept him as � The Messiah� and become his main followers. He will also have a great number of women followers as well. The entire secular world (Jews/Freemasons, Atheist, Christians, Hindus Etc.) shall unite under the banner of the Anti-Christ against Islam. Islam will be the only force standing between him and the total world domination.

Huzaifah (RA) says, �Dajjal will be blind in one eye�. This blind eye will be swollen like a grape : There will be a thick finger-like object in his eye. The letters �KAF�, �FE�, �RE� will be written on his forehead (meaning - Unbeliever). Every Muslim will be able to read these letters whether he is literate or illiterate. He will travel at great speeds by means of a gigantic animal-like a mule.....(MUSLIM & AHMAD).

Note: On the US one Dollar,  There is  a Masonic sign implicating DAJJAL, a pyramid with one eye - check it out, if you don�t believe me !! Underneath it which is written � Novus Ordo Seclorum� -- Translated as:  �NEW SECRET ORDER�.

Ubaidah Bin Saamit (RA) says, Prophet Muhammad (SAWS) said � I have explained DAJJAL to you, but I fear that you might not have understood. DAJJAL will be short, and his legs will be crooked. The hair on his head will be extremely twisted...... If you have any doubt regarding DAJJAL, remember that your Sustainer (ALLAH), is not one eyed. (Because DAJJAL will eventually claim to be God himself. His followers shall accept him as such). He will be able to split a person into two and then bring him back life again....(AHMAD).

Narrated Hudhayfah ibn al-Yaman: "Subay' ibn Khalid said: I came to Kufah at the time when Tustar was conquered. I took some mules from it. When I entered the mosque (of Kufah), I found there some people of moderate stature, and among them was a man whom you could recognize when you saw him that he was from the people of Hijaz.  I asked: Who is he? The people frowned at me and said: Do you not recognize him? This is Hudhayfah ibn al-Yaman, the companion of the Apostle of Allaah (peace_be_upon_him).  Then Hudhayfah said: People used to ask the Apostle of Allaah (peace_be_upon_him) about good, and I used to ask him about evil. Then the people stared hard at him.  He said: I know the reason why you dislike it. I then asked: Apostle of Allaah, will there be evil as there was before, after this good which Allaah has bestowed on us?  He replied: Yes. I asked: Wherein does the protection from it lie? He replied: In the sword. I asked: Apostle of Allaah, what will then happen?   He replied: If Allaah has on Earth a caliph who flays your back and takes your property, obey him, otherwise die holding onto the stump of a tree.  I asked: What will come next? He replied: Then the Antichrist (Dajjal) will come forth accompanied by a river and fire. He who falls into his fire will certainly receive his reward, and have his load taken off him, but he who falls into his river will have his load retained and his reward taken off him.  I then asked: What will come next? He said: The Last Hour will come.  (Translation of Sunan Abu-Dawud, Book 35, Trials and Fierce Battles (Kitab Al-Fitan Wa Al-Malahim), Number 4232)"

Narrated Mu'adh ibn Jabal: "The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The greatest war, the conquest of Constantinople and the coming forth of the Dajjal (Antichrist) will take place within a period of seven months.  (Translation of Sunan Abu- Dawud, Book 37, Battles (Kitab Al-Malahim), Number 4282)"

Narrated Abu Hurayrah: "The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: There is no prophet between me and him, that is, Jesus (peace_be_upon_him). He will descent (to the earth). When you see him, recognise him: a man of medium height, reddish fair, wearing two light yellow garments, looking as if drops were falling down from his head though it will not be wet. He will fight the people for the cause of Islaam. He will break the cross, kill swine, and abolish jizyah. Allaah will perish all religions except Islaam. He will destroy the Antichrist (Dajjal) and will live on the earth for forty years and then he will die. The Muslims will pray over him.   (Translation of Sunan Abu-Dawud, Book 37, Battles (Kitab Al-Malahim), Number 4310)"

Huzaifah (RA) also says, He will have with him WATER (Heaven) and FIRE (HELL). In reality his hell shall be heaven and his heaven shall be hell......(MUSLIM). In another Ahaadeeth of Our Prophet (SAWS) has said, that DAJJAL shall not know himself the difference between the two. If you are forced to choose between the two, then choose his fire (Hell), for in reality, it will be cool water, and his water (Heaven), shall be Hell.

Imraan Bin Hussain (RA) says the Prophet (SAWS) said ; �Those who hear about DAJJAL should stay far from him. By Allah! A person will approach him thinking him to be a believer, but on seeing his amazing feats, will become his follower�. (ABU DAWOOD). 

Note : DAJJAL will have the power to cause Famine, Earth quakes and destruction on a mass scale. Many Muslims will join the ranks of DAJJAL on being afraid of his power. Only those with very strong faith will be able to resist. Remember that once you have joined the Anti-Christ, your soul will be doomed forever in the fire of hell. O Brothers / Sisters please come to the religion of Islam and prepare yourself for the big day. I hope this is of use to you and may Allah guide and protect us, so that we my spread the word of Allah in abundance. Ameen